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Thread ID: 60911	2005-08-17 22:03:00	Gentoo Pre-install Questions	Myth (110)	Press F1

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
381950	2005-08-17 22:03:00	I am seriously considering giving Gentoo a go (have already downloaded the Universal CD iso image - 2005.1). Am looking at downloading other image (applications cd) in next few days. Before I make this move into a more intermediate distro I want to clarify some concerns: Main concern; I have Windows on a 40 GB harddrive, as well as a 30GB FAT32 partition as the first partition on an 80GB drive. The remaining 50GB will be either for Linux, or I am thinking of resizing the 30GB partition to make it larger (and storing linux files on it - kinda like a /home). Will the Gentoo bootstrap loader (is it Lilo or Grub) see the Windows O/S and auto-configure itself? Would I be better trying a stage one tar, or for the first time should I just do stage 3? Does Gentoo have issues with nVidia drivers? I have GeForce MX440 grafix card. Basically; on a more advanced distro, what should I expect as far as installing it and configuring it????? p.s. I have been using FC4 as main O/S almost since it came out, was using FC3 as experimental journey into Linux, have briefly tried other distros (Mandrake, Ubuntu etc).ei	Myth (110)
381951	2005-08-18 00:56:00	Main concern; I have Windows on a 40 GB harddrive, as well as a 30GB FAT32 partition as the first partition on an 80GB drive . The remaining 50GB will be either for Linux, or I am thinking of resizing the 30GB partition to make it larger (and storing linux files on it - kinda like a /home) . Will the Gentoo bootstrap loader (is it Lilo or Grub) see the Windows O/S and auto-configure itself? It is the install process that sees the other partitions, and GRUB uses that info . The Gentoo install process, while looking very hideously difficult, is quite good . Would I be better trying a stage one tar, or for the first time should I just do stage 3? The stage 1 install is more difficult than the later stages, and is not recommended for beginners . But why not give it a try . The worst thing that could happen is that you learn something new . Just watch you don't kill the Windows partitions . Does Gentoo have issues with nVidia drivers? I have GeForce MX440 grafix card . It is not Gentoo or any other distro itself (though not always true), it is the version of X . Currently, the nVidia driver is supposed to be pretty good, as opposed to the ATI driver . Basically; on a more advanced distro, what should I expect as far as installing it and configuring it????? Expect to spend a lot of time getting the darn thing to work . Try and set up a net connection asap and install a browser - preferably lynx or links - so you can view the very good Gentoo handbook whilst you are completing the installation . p . s . I have been using FC4 as main O/S almost since it came out, was using FC3 as experimental journey into Linux, have briefly tried other distros (Mandrake, Ubuntu etc) . ei Those distros are all very GUI-centric and Gentoo may buzz you out, but persistence counts for a lot . Good luck .	vinref (6194)
381952	2005-08-18 05:29:00	I certainly don't consider myself a dab hand with Linux. And as you can see from a recent post I get stumped with what would be a simple problem for the likes of vinref, Jen or Chill. However last Feb, I installed a stage 3 Gentoo and while it wasn't easy I found the process interesting, I think I learnt a lot and there was a definite feeling of achievement when I had completed it. I did have to wrestle with some aspects of it; in particular the bootloader, Grub. But once I got X windows configured and KDE up & running, what a buzz and its a distro I consider to be very good and customisable for the user, you don't have to have all the extraneous junk that comes with other distros. Previously I have played around with Libranet, which I thought was very good and it got good reviews as well; but I believe Gentoo is better. I would like to try a stage 1, one day but as vinref would realise from my post about probs I'm having with Portage, there's probably some gaps in my knowledge that need to be addressed. But from the tone of your post I'd say you'd have a good enough understanding to give it a go. :thumbs:	jcr1 (893)
381953	2005-08-18 06:14:00	I've done a stage one install of Gentoo, and while the handbook is excellent for instructions, having a bit of know-how (basic troubleshooting) for the points where things don't go to plan is handy. A stage1 is pure command line and it is one way of getting used to finding your way around the system without any GUI's. A stage1 also starts from scratch so you will be compiling/configuring all your system files (plus anything else you want) from source code. This will take time and it will mean you will not be able to use that machine until you have finished that session. Once I had the system at the equivalent of a stage3 and started on the GUI's, from memory, compiling a basic Gnome plus a few apps to start with took about 18 hrs alone for that stage. This was on a P3 933 MHz with 384 MB RAM. A recent emerge world (updating the entire system) took about 56 hrs to download all the updated source code and recompile the system. Don't let this put you off, as it is a great way to learn. However, seeing the machine dual boots with XP expect it to be out of action for a couple of days during the installation processs. I also believe you are on a 1GB data cap for your ADSL ... well a stage1 involves downloading all your source code for the entire system which can add up very fast. Just keep this in mind. :) My recommendation would be to try a stage3 first so that you can see what is involved and it means the minimum downtime for your machine, or if you don't mind having no machine (as possibly losing Windows) for a longer period of time then just go for gold and try a stage1 (or a stage2 as a mid-way point) :thumbs:. Have a read of the Gentoo installation document so that you can see what is involved. :) As jcr1 mentioned, it is a real rush to see your system boot into full life for the first time knowing that you built it from scratch. Same sort of feeling you get when your first computer you built boots into life without anything blowing up and works first pop. :D	Jen (38)
381954	2005-08-18 06:27:00	I'm intrigued by this . Gentoo is great because you get to compile all the system utilities and applications . This makes for a more efficient system . How many years of running this fast efficient Gentoo system will it take to save the hours it takes to compile? And what if you don't get it right the first time, and have to do it again? Or if the second time isn't quite as efficient as you hoped? :D This is like the time when Air New Zealand were told to buy Rolls Royce engines . I think this was Rob Muldoon, trying to please Thatcher . The PR said this would save $1 million a year in fuel . The extra cost involved in the RR deal was $40 million . As far as I'm concerned, I will recompile a kernel to (perhaps) get a faster boot time . I'll compile a driver module . I'll compile the odd package which doesn't come as a binary . (I'll even be compiling gcc with patches so I can build a linux for Dreamcast console . . . ) But life is too short to compile all the code . I can find more interesting things to do than that . Like compiling my own code . There's nothing to be learned by compiling bash .	Graham L (2)
381955	2005-08-18 06:44:00	I'm intrigued by this. Gentoo is great because you get to compile all the system utilities and applications. This makes for a more efficient system. How many years of running this fast efficient Gentoo system will it take to save the hours it takes to compile? And what if you don't get it right the first time, and have to do it again? Or if the second time isn't quite as efficient as you hoped? :D From experience building Gentoo, Slackware, FreeBSD and NetBSD from source, the marginal gain in speed is "good" only for machines slower than 300 - 400 MHz. This marginal speed gain rapidly disappears the faster the machine and the more the applications you install and compile. However, if you choose your compile-time options carefully, it does result in a more secure, stable, more consistent and simpler machine. As far as I'm concerned, I will recompile a kernel to (perhaps) get a faster boot time. I'll compile a driver module. I'll compile the odd package which doesn't come as a binary. (I'll even be compiling gcc with patches so I can build a linux for Dreamcast console ... ) But life is too short to compile all the code. I can find more interesting things to do than that. Like compiling my own code. There's nothing to be learned by compiling bash. There are tricks around it. My favourite is fetching, compiling and installing stuff whilst I am asleep or at work.	vinref (6194)
381956	2005-08-18 06:48:00	How many years of running this fast efficient Gentoo system will it take to save the hours it takes to compile? And what if you don't get it right the first time, and have to do it again? Or if the second time isn't quite as efficient as you hoped? :DYou are quite right Graham. I did ponder this as I watched the hours tick by during compilation ... However, you do get a lean machine with only the apps you want on it and no other extra's. While my machine booted like greased lightning, and I compiled using appropriate optimised CFLAGS and CHOST variables etc, for everyday use it seemed not that a significance difference in speed compared to a binary based OS that took less than an hour to install. Even updating Firefox was a 4 hour compilation compared to seconds using a binary RPM :p. Don't overlook the g33k factor and the knowledge you gained by doing things the slow way. I couldn't stop smiling for hours when my system did its first full boot to X and there was my desktop, seen for the first time :D But life is too short to compile all the code. I can find more interesting things to do than that. Like compiling my own code. There's nothing to be learned by compiling bash.Yeah, the actual compilation is done by the compiler so you just watch it work away. You do however learn how to tweake the optimisation flags to compile a more efficient application that is tailor-made for your system and needs. And if you break it, well then you get to learn how to fix it again ... and again.	Jen (38)
381957	2005-08-18 07:22:00	The grub.conf.example file will work fine with WinXP, it has the example you just have to specify the partition... There's only an extra couple of commands between a stage1 & a stage 3, but start with Stage3 for a first-time user :) nVidia driver has no problems with the gentoo-kernel (Soley 2.6.* now) I agree, but the speed increase when using optimised CFLAGS compared to normal CFLAGS (generic/none) is noticeable. As was mentioned, overnight installs are good. Interactivity is something I noticed was better when running with nice CFLAGS. You can also use LDFLAGS for more gain!! Give it a shot, Im sure you wont be disappointed. NOTHING beats the Gentoo documentation. The handbook is massive and covers all the bases	Chilling_Silence (9)
381958	2005-08-18 07:26:00	Remember that you don't always learn much when you just follow very good step-by-step instructions.	Jeremy (1197)
381959	2005-08-18 08:02:00	Same can be said for LFS.... But you'd be surprised. You're right, usually you learn when stuff breaks :D	Chilling_Silence (9)
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