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Thread ID: 70289	2006-06-28 03:51:00	M$ & WGA Hit The Fan Again:	SurferJoe46 (51)	Press F1

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
466806	2006-06-29 10:21:00	Well some patches dont need validation. Depending on what the file / update is. BUT some do.Never come across one yet personally.	Greg (193)
466807	2006-06-29 15:28:00	Never come across one yet personally . You will . . . it all goes to a head in about September . MY son says that those without SP-2 will be marked as troublemakers (his term, not M$'s) and they will be flagged for the dead man's switch then and the screen will go blank . You do not own the system, just the key/license to run it on their terms . Read the EULA .	SurferJoe46 (51)
466808	2006-06-29 22:48:00	Interesting... How long has this (www.imagef1.net.nz) been the case? Isn't this a farly serious mis-representation? It's obviously not required, but it's not possible to update until you install it. And NOWHERE during the install process was I presented with a EULA :(	Erayd (23)
466809	2006-06-29 23:10:00	You will...I don't think so Tim. Like pctek I've never seen the need to constantly update or patch. I don't really bother anymore, unless it's something like the patch for Windows Media Player that came out earlier this year.	Greg (193)
466810	2006-06-30 00:20:00	I don't think so Tim . Like pctek I've never seen the need to constantly update or patch . I don't really bother anymore, unless it's something like the patch for Windows Media Player that came out earlier this year . It's like this . . . you may not be getting reminders to update and upgrade things, but that's ok too . . . it's just that ignorance of the changes will bite you in the butt someday . . . . and I thought I might do the Paul Revere thing to let the cat outta the bag and tell that Mr . Bill is coming . I too am beginning to drag my feet with M$ WGA insertions, and Linux is indeed getting better-looking every day . I will stay with M$ until they do or say things that I just cannot stomach and I am off the Linux-Land . Right now, I am denying them the opportunity to download WGA spyware into my system, and I have slammed the port(s) it wants to use too via my Linksys router . Let them eat cake . Don't listen to the man behind the curtains . . . . .	SurferJoe46 (51)
466811	2006-06-30 02:38:00	Brian Livingston in the latest WindowsSecrets newsletter recommends dumping Windows updates. and also gives a link to MS, who now officially describe how to remove WGA: http://www.windowssecrets.com/ support.microsoft.com	Terry Porritt (14)
466812	2006-06-30 04:58:00	Don't Microsoft realise that they are alienating any intelligent person out there who buys their software? For every person who is concerned about Microsoft's underhand tactics there are probably 100 or more who don't know about it or don't care so why would MS be concerned about people like us? We won't be their bread and butter . The average Mr and Mrs Joe Hunt whose PCs were already configured for automatic updates when purchased probably don't even realise their OS is updating itself regularly, never mind understand why or have any clue about what is going on in the background . And even if they do know about the updates they trust Microsoft and wouldn't even dream that MS would do anything sneaky . :rolleyes: It's only geeks like us that worry about such things and there aren't really all that many of us . :groan:	FoxyMX (5)
466813	2006-06-30 05:30:00	Ya know, you're right Foxy one . . . . I remember a poster that was printed during the VietNam War . . . . It had a field of daiseys and green grass and the words wandered around on down the front of the poster: Suppose they gave a war and nobody came! Same thing here . . . the world is so caught up in just surviving moment to moment that they never feel the water starting to boil around them . . . too bad for the lemmings .	SurferJoe46 (51)
466814	2006-06-30 06:03:00	Thanks for the link to the WindowsSecrets newsletter, Terry. It was interesting. Although I'm as interested as anyone in conspiracy theories, my journalistic training is starting to ring a warning bell here about how quickly a report from one person seems to be dispersing so rapidly across the Net that shortly it'll be generally accepted as true. I don't mean the criticims of WGA & its problems, but the suggestion that M/S will release a "kill switch" for unverified copies of Windows. Well, maybe they will. It would be the worst possible public relations exercise imagineable - and cause such an uproar that they might lose more customers than it was worth - but possibly they could be nuts enough to do it... However, so far that's just speculation - not fact. The suggestion comes from a Dave Farber & was picked up by Ed Bott's Blog headed: M/S about to Release a " kill switch." There are 2 links to it in this thread. With almost the speed of light, it's touring the world - not attributed to any named source by now. (As in SurerJoe's post: "My son says...") Does the fact that M/S didn't immediately deny it make it true? As M/S isn't renown for speed in anything - it could mean only that their PRO department hasn't got off its backside yet. (And if there's been something today that I've missed, sorry) I don't mean that we shouldn't be outraged at that idea & express opinions about it. It's appalling. But it's only an idea = so far.	Laura (43)
466815	2006-06-30 06:32:00	Here's the only semi-denial from M$ (at the end of my part here), but first some other info: Again, I told a week or so ago that M$ was going hunting for corporate licenses that are being abused, and that got me some heat from a few people . . . they thought it was against the corporations that it was intended, not so! It is the people who move from the corporate environment of the company that installed XP for them and they didn't remove it when terminated . Some have even posted the keys online for others to use . As long as the total number of users didn't exceed the licensed amount all was darkly mysterious . . but when the keys got out, of course, there was a slug of people using that pirated key . This is what the original furor was all about . Now M$ has said it will black out those pirated keys . That is a fact . . . and the next step of course, is blacking out those that their sniffers deem as pirated copies too . That is the extent of the official word . . . . . Now on to my son's account: He was right about the part above as you have seen . He said that indeed, there are going to be a lot of unhappy people, who for some reason or another, have not updated . . . and that includes SP-2 and WGA . Now . . . . this is what M$ noses out as probably a bogus installation . Those that don't upgrade are probably trying to hide from M$ and their sniffers . That's the whole gist of the story . . . so far! Profiling is nasty as it places people in a "prove you aren't running bogus Windows, but until that time, stare at a black screen" catagory . I do not put that away lightly . . . as the profile of the user of a hacked version or pirated copy is informed to NEVER get any M$ updates . . as they don't know if the user will then get caught . . . . resulting in they themselves being indicated as an accessories before the fact . Here in the US, it is a federal offense to have on your possession a copy of XP with a hacked key written on the cd or the envelope or the case in which it is transported . Archived copies are deeply frowned-upon and are grounds for arrest . Look at the RIAA stuff and P2P and IRQ file-traders . The music industry has levied some fearful tactics on grannies who let their grandkids use the puters at their house . . . and the father or mother of some file-trader who posts as well as receives mp3's, and sends them to jail or heavily fines them thru the very agreeable courts . Here's the latest story on the M$ vs The World Front: 28 June 2006 Microsoft backs down on WGA By Eric Lai and Elizabeth Montalbano, Computerworld (US online) Microsoft has released an updated version of its anti-piracy program that changes the frequency with which the program checks for pirated or counterfeit copies of its client operating system . A new version of Microsoft's Windows Genuine Advantage (WGA) Notifications program available now no longer checks a server-side configuration of a user's version of Windows every time the user logs on to see if it is a valid copy of Windows . Instead, it periodically checks to see if the user's copy is genuine . "Our customers have told us that they were disappointed with their WGA Notifications experience, and we have made an effort to improve that with this update," said the company . Microsoft has mounted an aggressive program to eliminate counterfeit and pirated versions of Windows, and WGA is a part of that . The program was first distributed not as an automatic update, but to users of Microsoft's download services who wanted to install add-on software, excluding security releases, for Windows . Microsoft later updated it with the WGA Notifications program, distributed as part of Microsoft's Automatic Updates, which reminds users their copy of Windows is not genuine and informs them of what Microsoft calls the "benefits" of using authentic Windows software . Users can opt out of WGA Notifications, but not the WGA program in general if they want to use Microsoft's download services . With the new release of WGA Notifications, Microsoft is including instructions for removing an older version of the program from a PC as Knowledge Base article No . 921914 on Microsoft . com, the company said . Since WGA's release last year, users have complained of bugs in the program that identified legitimate copies of Windows as counterfeit . A privacy advocate also accused the WGA Notifications of acting like spyware, since it sends information about a user's PC back to Microsoft automatically without letting the user know exactly what information is being sent . Upgrading the program so it does not contact Microsoft every time a user logs in should help remedy the latter issue . The new version of WGA Notifications also includes a more comprehensive End User License Agreement that clearly explains the purpose of the software and details about the program, Microsoft said . Paul DeGroot, an analyst with Directions on Microsoft, said for most consumers using legal copies of Windows XP, WGA probably "wasn't much of an issue . " The bigger problem is one of perception, especially after the spyware accusation, he said . "For WGA to phone home everyday was causing problems for some people," DeGroot said . "Microsoft may have blown a lot of credibility here . " Rather than attack the problem of pirated consumer copies of Windows, Microsoft with WGA is targeting volume licences of Windows purchased by corporations that have been leaked out to non-legal users, he said . With copies of Windows purchased in retail stores or pre-installed on consumer PCs, each Windows CD is accompanied by an individual activation key . Through the Internet, Microsoft can track how many PCs have been installed using that particular key . But when corporations buy volume licenses, they receive a single key that's used to install Windows on hundreds or thousands of machines . "Because volume keys are still just strings of characters in plain-text that lots of people in any large organisation have access to, it's relatively easy for them to leak out," DeGroot said . "To be blunt, they were an accident waiting to happen . " With WGA, Microsoft can detect whether a volume license key for Windows is being used by a non-licensed user . DeGroot has not heard of Microsoft fining or penalising corporations that lose keys . But with Microsoft deactivating pirated volume license keys, companies might have to reinstall new ones on all of their computers . That can either be done remotely through an intranet, or manually by IT staffers visiting each individual PC . Depending on how involved that process becomes, it could mean up to US$25 per PC in staff costs, DeGroot said . "It's a real pain in the butt," he said . Microsoft is working to make the problem moot, DeGroot said . The Windows Vista client operating system and Longhorn Server OS will have volume licence keys encrypted and stored on a server . "They'll never be sent over a network in plain text," he said . "They will be a lot safer . "	SurferJoe46 (51)
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