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Thread ID: 77624	2007-03-16 05:51:00	why do u need an ISP?	mark c (247)	Press F1

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
533519	2007-03-16 07:32:00	the internet is a very large collection of computer that are all linked together....(i think we all know that bit :-) ) an ISP is simply a point at which you connect in to the bigger collection. if your friend is on the internet and he runs a wire to your house and lets you share his connection then he becomes your ISP. the boys who started IHUG (1993-ish) had a chat to the local university (who had the very big cable to USA back in the day) and got a big cable, then thay got 100 phone lines and patched it all togeather. in a perfect world anyone can be an ISP, in the real world the telcos own most of the big data cables in the world and so most telcos are ISPs as for what your ISP gives you.... email servers (they store your spam when your not online) DNS servers. web hosting. help desk.	robsonde (120)
533520	2007-03-16 07:32:00	Basic Internet. The internet is made up of lots of companies that allow other companies to connect to their network. So you start with two companies A and B who have connected their networks together. everything is sweet. Then comes along company C who talks to company B so and they reach an agreement and join their networks together. So now company A can talk to B and the other way round and company C can talk to B and of course the other way round. So a computer at company A then tries to contact a computer belonging to company C. Nothing, doesn’t work. So company A talks to company C and they join their networks together. Ok – have you got a picture of this in your head. Ok were now going to add companies D,E,F,G ..... is your head hurting yet ? (It should be). Getting complicated isn’t it? Company B had a real smart guy and they figure, we can simplify the whole thing, why don’t we let companies A,C,D,E,F and G all pass traffic to each other through us and we will change them for it. And so was born the first ISP, and if you’ve got a mental picture of all the possible connections before the ISP was born, you’re a lot smarter than me but you should also have worked out why we need ISPs. By the way – company B probably turned into a Tier 1 ISP, and the techie term for allowing other companies to connect to your network and pass data is peering, something NZ ISPs don’t appear to be to good at which is why lots of traffic destined to go from NZ machine to NZ machines ends up overseas on its way there.	gcarmich (10068)
533521	2007-03-16 08:06:00	Q Why do You need an ISP. A Service and Price Yes we could have all our Internet connections through Telecom. And they could charge what ever they like. With different ISP they can offer a better price and/or service.. In other words Competition	wmoore (6009)
533522	2007-03-16 08:20:00	Ok so the title says it all. Hi all you learned and helpful people. What does an ISP actually do? OK so they may 'provide' a filtering service for spam and viri and malware in general and cache a lot of sites but other than that (which you can do yourself) what do they do? Why do you (we) need them? I was yakking to a friend about this and they said IHUG started up just like that, a couple people thought hey we could set up our own ISP and avoid the charges. I have had a look around online but came up with nothing conclusive. TIA........m They do a lot more than filter spam and viruses (some however do neither). Yes anyone could set themselves up as an ISP, but you would need a lot of money for the hardware and ongoing relationships with providers you use. Using an ISP, is simply sharing the cost of connecting to the interent with all the ISPs other customers. This is similar to electricity. Sure you can setup your own solar generator, build your own dam for hydro, our build your own nuclear powerplant, however this is uneconomical for most people, so most people connect to the national grid through their power company(which works like an ISP), so all users on the network share the cost and pay for what they use.	rogerp (6864)
533523	2007-03-16 08:22:00	Q Why do You need an ISP. A Service and Price Yes we could have all our Internet connections through Telecom. And they could charge what ever they like. With different ISP they can offer a better price and/or service.. In other words Competition OK so you're talking about the physical stuff like the wires and the "last 1/4 mile loop' "unbundling" or whatever ,that isn't the point. Strikes me, and i mean this most respectfully, that no-one really knows what we have ISPs for. Like.........competition, service......price,,,,,.like ISPs are all, giving us a good deal yeah like mangatanako breweries. seems like a 'emporer wvout is knicker' 2 me...........m	mark c (247)
533524	2007-03-16 08:45:00	Strikes me, and i mean this most respectfully, that no-one really knows what we have ISPs for. with all due respect..... re-read my post and then ask questions about it.	robsonde (120)
533525	2007-03-16 08:56:00	, but you would need a lot of money for the hardware and ongoing relationships with providers you use . TY this is what I was on about . Like what, like 40kg servers? Like heavy as a bag of cement and relationships with providers? Like forgetit, I doan wan't relationships with providers I want to avoid them . What do think they do -to go back to the original question .	mark c (247)
533526	2007-03-16 08:59:00	What does that mean? I have no probs with having to be connected in some way. (and paying for all that ol' copper wire) just don't see why i should have to pay what seems to me like a toll to connect when the toll gatherers don't really 'provide' me with anything. I take it your a wee bit too young to understand any of the rules of economics or business. In order to provide us with phone/internet cable and server hardware etc a company must spend BIG $$$$ laying the cable and purchasing the hardware and employing people to run all the stuff. Universities do this by way of government grants and large financial befactors (Private trust funds from wealthy families etc) Once they have done this they need to get a return on their investment (they need to get their customers to pay for it all.) Otherwise the company will go broke and you won't have a service provider. That is where you and I come into it when we pay for internet access and for various content like music/videos etc to be down loaded. That is the simplified version. Hope that helps. I think what your getting at is why are we still having to pay for stuff that theoretically should be FREE. Well free is great, but that would mean that the people supporting the system would be doing it in their own free time ( Like Linux coders) . This is all well and great but most people don't like being treated like a charity when they have bills and a mortgage to pay.	winmacguy (3367)
533527	2007-03-16 09:05:00	en.wikipedia.org	Metla (12)
533528	2007-03-16 09:09:00	thanx winmacguy I"m 55 so not a lil kiddy like you suggest but thats ok I will read yr post agian 'n' again But I'm still not konvinzint. Yr simplifed v. did not help. Yes I no about the commercial imperative. (Bull**** tho it is.)	mark c (247)
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