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Thread ID: 141622	2016-01-22 02:07:00	"I don't think I am a criminal......."	Zippity (58)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
1414944	2016-01-23 04:24:00	Black	prefect (6291)
1414945	2016-01-23 04:51:00	How did this guy with 5 daughters ever get a $300 000 mortgage on $30 000 a year? How did "this guy" ever get a $300K mortgage? With a University education and in the Cooks with that, esteem. With 5 daughters? What has that got to do with it?	WalOne (4202)
1414946	2016-01-23 19:45:00	Responding to kahawai chaser's post, the thing that rankles with me is that the people he described are the very people who took away the system that encouraged tertiary education via bursaries, once they had sucked all they could out of the system. It doesn't matter whether they were Labour or National, both mobs did the same thing - sucked on the hind teat of the state till they got what they wanted and then dismantled the system that gave them a leg up. People like Phil Goff as Minister of Education who presided over the introduction of the current fees and loans system. People like John Key whose mother was supported by State Housing and a benefit, whilst little Johnny no doubt got his tertiary education free. People like Paula Bennett, whose tertiary education was undertaken whilst she was on the DPB - I assume that she applied for and was granted the top up available to beneficiaries at the time to support them to get tertiary education (the Training Incentive Allowance). Whatever, she ordered the removal of that TIA once she became Minister. One by one, left and right politicians sucked all they could out of the State for their own benefit, and then pulled up the drawbridge behind them. This is not said in defence of people not paying their loans back - they should honour their contracts. My beef is with the two faced pollies. Good point(s) - Steven Joyce, Tertiary minister, is another one who had free tertiary education, and always trying to justify/simmer student loan woes. Another aspect I picked up at uni - was some of the prof's, associates prof's, lecturers taught a ton of theoretical/academia topics that are out of reach for industry (in NZ at the time). I admit I studied (and wasted 2 years level 3/4) way off topics "Ligand Field bonding theory" "Van der wals molecular theoretical equations" 1 -3rd laws of thermodynamics, and others. Some of those lecturers had it easy, regurgitating same topics, lounging around in the labs - and smoking, cross crediting to yet study or go on sabbaticals. Off to Oxford to expand their knowledge. In real world industry they would have been seriously reprimanded. I know - it was a shock moving into NZ industry, from being insulated in Uni labs, to labs governed by shareholders, Govt (though some were also theory based - like Uni a bit), banks, stakeholders, and global partnerships. Most wanted useful innovation (aka R 'n D), and costing out to ramp up profits.	kahawai chaser (3545)
1414947	2016-01-24 08:48:00	Responding to kahawai chaser's post, the thing that rankles with me is that the people he described are the very people who took away the system that encouraged tertiary education via bursaries, once they had sucked all they could out of the system. It doesn't matter whether they were Labour or National, both mobs did the same thing... People like Phil Goff as Minister of Education who presided over the introduction of the current fees and loans system. People like John Key whose mother was supported by State Housing and a benefit, whilst little Johnny no doubt got his tertiary education free. People like Paula Bennett, whose tertiary education was undertaken whilst she was on the DPB - I assume that she applied for and was granted the top up available to beneficiaries at the time to support them to get tertiary education (the Training Incentive Allowance). Whatever, she ordered the removal of that TIA once she became Minister. ...My beef is with the two faced pollies. Your thoughts John are echoed by many younger people and they deserve our sympathy but the trope that university was "free" in the 70s and 80s is mistaken. Prior to the introduction of student loans in 1992, every out of town student with UE was entitled to a Standard Tertiary Bursary. Mature adult students without UE didn't qualify. In the late 1970s as Kahawai refers above, the STB was $520 per year. That was slightly less than the cost of a hall of residence but it was a significant sum and much needed. If you didn't pass more than 50% of your course, you lost the STB. I well remember a warning letter. :D The STB made no allowance for university course fees, books, student union fees, etc etc etc. So most students relied upon mum and dad for the extra money and tried to get jobs in the holidays. As the years passed most of my friends had bank overdrafts and if the degree was long (law, medicine etc) got evening jobs. Women found it hard because holiday jobs were not well paid. A few of us guys were lucky and got jobs in the freezing works which paid far above the average wage but mostly jobs provided just enough to go back to study. Students certainly in their first year were enthusiastic beer drinkers in pubs but it was cheap - 60c/jug. And I always noticed the girls drank little unless it was a wine and cheese event. Students today are entitled to a student allowance of $160/wk which is the equivalent of the old STB. The difference though is that if your parents have a sufficiently high income, your allowance is reduced and in some cases disappears. That is a major difference but really its only reflecting what happened generations before. Your parents did the best they could and helped pay for you. And if they can't - then you are entitled to a Student Allowance.	Winston001 (3612)
1414948	2016-01-24 22:55:00	University wast free back in the 70/s & 80's, but it was damn cheap. So cheap that many would just go to uni after high school, simply because they could , and drop out after a year or so, or get a degree that had no corresponding job . Then in the 2000's ish, scamming dodgy teaching facilties would open up & offer courses in things like skydiving or music recording & cream the govt subsidies for these courses .	1101 (13337)
1414949	2016-01-26 01:02:00	Winston - yes. I did my degree under the old regime (1964 - 1969 incl), so that is familiar. I accept that it wasn't free, but I went through the 7th form and had a Higher Leaving Certificate so I had a Fees and Allowances bursary. That meant that as well as my fees being paid (apart from the Stud Ass fee) I received three payments a year in allowances. None of that was enough to live on, so I had to support myself in work of various kinds. Fruit picking in Earnscleugh, fellmongery and hay carting in Gore, fellmongery in Kaiapoi, acting in radio and tv, law clerking, and operating at a telephone answering service in ChCh during the year on a part time basis. Work was always easy to obtain in those days, and we were able to save enough to come out of university education debt free. I later did a post grad diploma and was paid by the gumberment to do so (regular salary, bonded four years for two years of study so it was a six year commitment). My wife was paid as a teacher trainee in year three of her degree and her post grad diploma at Teachers College, and later at Library School. Contrary to what you said, I didn't rely on my father for support, except for board in year one. I never had a bank overdraft either because I was able to pay my way with job related income. The rents were incredibly low then - I think we paid 10 pounds a week for a two bedroom flat, shared between four of us. We all moaned, and were fast into the queues on allowance days each term, but somehow, even those from families who could not support their kids into tertiary education managed to get by without loans. By contrast, two of my children ended up with student loans, neither of them horrific, but still a debt is a debt when you are starting out in life. My wife and I (without each other's knowledge) were both sending the eldest regular sums of money, but only found out later that most of it went on mountaineering and skiing gear instead of rent, books and food... I know it is old fashioned, and the usual suspects here will do their usual pathetic whinge about me being a commie, but I always supported Bill Sutch's writings on the imperative of State investment in the education of its population as one of the most important ways in which the country can grow its labour force capability and compete in the modern international economy. Unfortunately we got Douglas and Richardson and their acolytes instead.	John H (8)
1414950	2016-01-26 03:10:00	Stud Ass fee Pardon?? Ken :devil	kenj (9738)
1414951	2016-01-26 05:29:00	I still can't see how that guy racked up $130000 in student debt, when my boy was looking at becoming a commercial pilot the loan was only going to be $90000. That guy wasn't anywhere near that level only doing an arts degree so his debt should have been no more than $40000	gary67 (56)
1414952	2016-01-26 05:49:00	The debt would have been much smaller, but 20 years of ignoring it while being charged interest will do that to a debt.	dugimodo (138)
1414953	2016-01-26 22:13:00	The debt would have been much smaller, but 20 years of ignoring it while being charged interest will do that to a debt. Yes you are correct - apparently his original student loan was $40,000. It has ballooned with interest over 10+ years. The irony is as a Cook Islander he could have applied for the interest to be nil and slowly paid back the $40k even if it took 30 years. I suspect the interest will be forgiven and some arrangement come to which IRD often do in order to get some payment rather than nothing. I don't believe that this man never heard from them in the past - he simply ignored them.	Winston001 (3612)
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