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Thread ID: 66730	2006-03-05 21:05:00	Proof, that most of us on middle-incomes are going backwards	KiwiTT_NZ (233)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
435848	2006-03-07 02:30:00	It's similar to the difference between pricing on a cost plus basis which can be the road to ruin, or pricing on a value basis. Now then, I can't remember, but it was Lord so and so, the chairman of Glacier Metal Company, the auto bearing manufacturer, and inventors of Glacier DU bearing material, who wrote one of the definitive books on value pricing. IE. If the dollar drops too low, and prices of commodities are not adjusted upwards, then customers will just laugh at us, and all the farmers will have heaps of worthless paper money in the bank. I have no recollection of that happening,perhaps you can help us.	Cicero (40)
435849	2006-03-07 03:10:00	Let's first of all deal with Cic :) Of course you have no recollection of what may happen in the future, it hasn't happened yet.......... :) Now KiwiTT_NZ; I'm amazed you cannot see any problem with a fairly rapid fall in the dollar to 55 US cents. Where to start? First of all since 1984 and on, NZ hardly makes anything except food. Just have a wander round the shops and look for "Made in NZ". So overnight we are going to have round about 16% inflation, petrol $1.80 a litre. Human nature being what it is imagine the clamour for compensatory wage rises so as to maintain the standard of living. Back in Muldoons day when the exchange rate was maintained, and it was around 40 cents, he had to borrow foreign currency to maintain peoples expectations. We had interest rates of 18-20% and galloping wage inflation, and wage freezes, what a shambles. New Zealanders didn't know how harsh the outside world really was, they were buffered by Muldoon, until 1984 that is, when reality set in. They hardly knew what was happening in the outside world, news was exceedingly parochial. That's all gone. So there is no show of a "fortress New Zealand" situation now. So, look out for massive unemployment and NZ heading to be a Weimar Republic. If the decline was gradual, then adjustments could be made, but sometimes these things can happen rapidly with overshoot, that is the danger.	Terry Porritt (14)
435850	2006-03-07 03:23:00	Terry, we're well on the way towards $1000000 postage stamps already.	Graham L (2)
435851	2006-03-07 03:23:00	Let make it slower then . I . e . in one year 60c and in two years 55c . And what is wrong with $1 . 80 litre petrol, get a lot of those SUVs off the road and getting people buying more enviromentally friendly cars . Transport via rail will be more attractive again . Inflation will be on mostly imports . We have too many shops selling crap now anyhow . And for what, does it make people happy . Maybe we should go through a period of hardship in the retail sector . People may then begin to buy quality again, i . e . for a longer period of time . What to we need: - Food . We make our own as you say . - Houses . We have plenty of timber . - Power . We have plenty of rivers . Just dam a few more more . - Telephone . Already installed in most places . - Internet . Costly, but that is not an international price fault . - Consumer Goods . Just buy less . - Petrol . See comments above . Phew . Not too hard really . We can then start exporting what we do well, Farming products etc . Our Services will be cheaper too buy . More Films (very successful of late) . IT (many successful examples) . We just need to stop spending !	KiwiTT_NZ (233)
435852	2006-03-07 03:30:00	Let's first of all deal with Cic :) Of course you have no recollection of what may happen in the future, it hasn't happened yet . . . . . . . . . . :) Now KiwiTT_NZ; I'm amazed you cannot see any problem with a fairly rapid fall in the dollar to 55 US cents . Where to start? First of all since 1984 and on, NZ hardly makes anything except food . Just have a wander round the shops and look for "Made in NZ" . So overnight we are going to have round about 16% inflation, petrol $1 . 80 a litre . Human nature being what it is imagine the clamour for compensatory wage rises so as to maintain the standard of living . Back in Muldoons day when the exchange rate was maintained, and it was around 40 cents, he had to borrow foreign currency to maintain peoples expectations . We had interest rates of 18-20% and galloping wage inflation, and wage freezes, what a shambles . New Zealanders didn't know how harsh the outside world really was, they were buffered by Muldoon, until 1984 that is, when reality set in . They hardly knew what was happening in the outside world, news was exceedingly parochial . That's all gone . So there is no show of a "fortress New Zealand" situation now . So, look out for massive unemployment and NZ heading to be a Weimar Republic . If the decline was gradual, then adjustments could be made, but sometimes these things can happen rapidly with overshoot, that is the danger . One does like a bit of brevity,you certainly dealt to me . Now about what followed that,talk about the dark side . Managed to find this for you T, . depressionforums . org/forums/index . php" target="_blank">www . depressionforums . org Hope it helps . :lol:	Cicero (40)
435853	2006-03-07 05:13:00	One does like a bit of brevity,you certainly dealt to me. Now about what followed that,talk about the dark side. Managed to find this for you T, www.depressionforums.org Hope it helps. :lol: Oh, You Have No Idea (www.redhotjazz.com) how much lift I get out of being a doomsayer, and as the song goes There's No Depression In Love (www.amazon.com)	Terry Porritt (14)
435854	2006-03-07 05:17:00	Oh, You Have No Idea (www.redhotjazz.com) how much lift I get out of being a doomsayer, and as the song goes There's No Depression In Love (www.amazon.com) Oh what a pity,I don't have the necessary to listen.	Cicero (40)
435855	2006-03-07 07:25:00	" And what is wrong with $1 . 80 litre petrol, " Most people don't earn enough to afford it . " get a lot of those SUVs off the road and getting people buying more enviromentally friendly cars . " What SUV? and but a new on with What? I paid $800 for my car . " Transport via rail will be more attractive again . " What rail transport? Would be ok if it wasn't a joke . " Maybe we should go through a period of hardship in the retail sector . People may then begin to buy quality again, i . e . for a longer period of time . " Again, people go to the Warehouse because its cheap . - Food . We make our own as you say . We make some food . - Houses . We have plenty of timber . Theres more to it than timber and we only have pine in any numbers . - Power . We have plenty of rivers . Just dam a few more more . Oh sure, look what happened in Otago - it got cancelled because of all the protests . We can then start exporting what we do well, Farming products etc . We already do that . We are not the only country in the world selling these products . I don't know what you imagine the average wage is now .	pctek (84)
435856	2006-03-07 09:01:00	I made a boo-boo on the exchange rate in Muldoons time, I said 40 cents, it should have been 62 cents. The exchange rate against the pound was about 40 pence.	Terry Porritt (14)
435857	2006-03-10 05:09:00	Missed most of this enjoyable debate - been away on a school camp in Deep Cove in Doubtful Sound and it has confirmed my belief that we are very fortunate people. Just a couple of thoughts. The $NZ was at 39c in about 2000. Despite the obvious advantage to exporters there was no boom in new industries or indeed for agriculture. The boom that did eventually occur was at much higher exchange rates and was a pure function of world dairy, meat and wool prices rising to high levels. In fact we had been doing well even at $NZ70c, but international prices have dropped. Unfortunately we are price takers as a nation, not price makers because we don't produce anything which the world is screaming to buy. I have no truck with Faye Richwhite and spurn them as I would a rabid dog. But most wealthy people have a low profile, employ people, and come by their assets honestly. I agree there is a disconnect between the payments to CEOs and their workers. There are groups in the US which have focused on this and forced companies to review high end salaries. Petrol will rise with a lower exchange rate but oddly enough Kiwis are not price sensitive. We love our cars and our independance. Generally consumption pauses and then returns to normal. I suspect we'd need to pay $3.00/litre before consumption would drop. I agree with Terry that we've lost expertise and should put more into research and development. But this needs to be lead from Parliament and in schools because at the moment science isn't a sexy educational option - as opposed to the 19th century when learned people were revered.	Winston001 (3612)
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