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Thread ID: 80961	2007-07-11 00:15:00	No more food from China please !	Digby (677)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
567951	2007-07-14 21:04:00	Germany :D on a puny NZ salary ;-) Anyway,we are so small what can we do really .... Maybe NZ can buy all food and products in Italy,France, Germany,UK Actually in Europe they have similar trouble with the eastern block countries, cheap labour, cheap shoddy goods, cheap food. And if my memory serves me (which if fails to do way too often) doesn't the UK import ship loads from China (was in the News near Christmas). France imports most of its fruit & Vegies from Spain, and do you really want to eat German food?	porkster (6331)
567952	2007-07-15 11:28:00	When you buy anything from a company (even a NZ company) that makes stuff in china, you are actually making things more expensive for yourself in the future, and are also causing damage to the world. This is because supporting chinas economy is making china richer, and they are then putting more demand on the worlds resources, which in turn makes them more expensive for all. Not t mention china is the worlds leading polluter, due to making all the rubbish, using unsustainable energy such as coal powerplants. The solution is to avoid chona all together, and keep them in the third world, which will also bring down the worlds carbon footprint. Unfortionately people don't look into the future, which is why there are major problems looming. Global warming, rising sea levels, more extreme weather, higher fuel prices, higher natural resource prices etc. I tend to agree with you, but your remarks on pollution are wrong. Yes China is a big polluter, but the stuff the world is buying from them has to be made someone so the same amount of pollution will occur. And once Chinese government officials get an idea they will stop at nothing to put it through. Eg they are worried about pollution in Beijing with the Olympics coming up. In an effort to alleviate it they are taking one million cars off the roads for a month ! Would any other country do that ? Regards Digby	Digby (677)
567953	2007-07-15 12:56:00	I tend to agree with you, but your remarks on pollution are wrong . Yes China is a big polluter, but the stuff the world is buying from them has to be made someone so the same amount of pollution will occur . And once Chinese government officials get an idea they will stop at nothing to put it through . Eg they are worried about pollution in Beijing with the Olympics coming up . In an effort to alleviate it they are taking one million cars off the roads for a month ! Would any other country do that ? Regards Digby Incorrect about pollution . If the stuff was made in the NZ, the same amount of pollution wouldn't occur, as we use hydro to generate much of our electricity . Therefore we don't pollute when we generate electricity, unlike china, who are opening a new coal fired powerplant ever week to cope with their increased electricty demands . Not to mention the carbon miles in transporting the rubbish they make around the world, a lot of which ends up in the land fills after a very little period of time . Europe are on to it regading the carbon miles with transporting stuff around . The fact that china are closing down many of their coal fire power plants and taking cars off the road for the olympics, is more of a case that they don't want the world to see them as being highly polluted, rather than any conscience about polluting the world . It is also for the health of the athletes, and also the olympic commettie were very concerned about the pollution, to such an extent that china could lose the games if the pollution caused problems for the competitors .	robbyp (2751)
567954	2007-07-15 20:59:00	I donnow . . . . I spent some short time in Japan . . landed in snow that was falling . . . and it was brown . The smog was so bad I coughed almost all the time . Japan was the dirtiest place I'd been except for Subic Bay . . which is called the "Armpit of the Pacific" . But after that trip to Japan (it wasn't Lotus blossom or cherry time . . it was Winter), I think Japan is the "Crotch of the Pacific" . Little old ladies . . . at least I thought they were old ladies, were cooking in single-coal hibachis in the gutters where they got their cooking water after someone up-gutter from them had just rinsed out some clothes . Old men slept under footbridges and near the rivers and harbors . Snow was plowed into piles of blackened grey matter . I visited Honshu, Fujikyu Highlands, Tokyo, The Ginza, Sasebo, Sendai . . . . . . all the same filth . The people smelled, the air stank was damp and dirty with visible grey dust falling all over the place from the coke-fired stoves and cooking . Nikko and a few places were clean, but I felt they were just that way for the tourists . No . . Japan was dirty, disgusting and nasty . This was in 1970 . Now . . China was a delight! It was clean, bright and I never felt any smog at all . The people there were kind . . even to a US Naval sailor in uniform . They appreciated my interest in them, took me to their own tables and families for meals and some really insightful social activities . Gotta admit that I wasn't seeing the tourists' usual haunts . . but I went out to the not-likely-to-be-seen areas and gathered my opinions from there . I actually cried at the Tianamin (sp?) Square thing . There have been articles in the Smithsonian magazine about the "off grid" buildings that are going up all over China . It's all very positive . Their biggest problem is that they are running out of local talent in the close surrounding villages and the transportation of workers and employees will necessitate motor vehicles of some sort soon . Bicycle transportation is likely limited to 4 or 5 miles; much further than that is silly for the people to even consider . A few bugs . . trolleys and buses are not set up for this solution either . Now . . . . . I don't hold China totally harmless either . They are users and abusers of things for so long that I don't think the real effects of their industrial revolution is as appears . We get a lot of tools and machinery here that is just 3rd rate in quality of alloys and finish . Typically they work well, but not long as the bearings fail and the windings in the motors lose insulation and start burning the fields and stators . . etc . Their abrasives lose surface quickly, tossing chunks of media from the paper very early in use . Their grinding stones and wheels consume very rapidly and often run off-axis and wobble or toss the stones . Their pitiful tool steel looses edges and cannot be resharpened successfully . . . . and I know how to sharpen a drill too . Chisels and punches are soft and mushroom and lose their cutting edge first use . Many times the cutting edge gets notched by material that should not affect the cutter at all . US companies have a lease setup in places in China that were supposed to be a godsend . . . far from it . A very large manufacturing plant was opened by US Caterpillar, a tractor and earth-moving equipment company of tremendous repute . The deal was that the US assembly line would run for the usual 40 hour week, and the rest of the time, the Chinese would build their own stuff on the same assembly line . . but with their own Chinese alloys . The tooling would be all US Caterpillar . The name of the Chinese line is "Lotus" and the fittings, thread-sizes and even the paint and dimensions were all the same, all the parts were interchangeable . . . . . just the different logo . Many companies here in the States found that if they bought the Chinese "Cats" they were a lot cheaper . . . but had weaknesses that the real Cats didn't . They usually were 1/3 to 1/4 the cost of a real tractor or earth mover . So . . when (not "if") an inferior part broke, it would be replaced by a genuine Cat part . . never to break again . That's rotten to the max . The bean-counters approve . We had a presidential candidate here in the US a while back: Ross Perot . He was a very successful big company businessman . His platform was aligned with keeping the third-world out of the labor pool, protection of US tools, electronics and autos . . etc . He had a rally cry of "After the election if I am not elected, the giant sucking sound you will hear is the sound of US jobs going South of the border" . He was referring to the new idea of an open trade border between the US and Mexico with no import or duty/fees for out of country goods . Mexico has no or very few people who really care about their own country, and they allow anyone to import into their country, to ultimately export it through the US/Mexico border eventually . He was right . The US is now in competition with every mud hut business owner . . middle man or entrepreneur . NZ gets the dregs of that activity too . . don't think you are not affected! The big cat (US) has been relinquished to the position of lap kitty and everyone's at a loss for it . For what you think or what it was really worth . . the world is not better or anywhere near the same as it was just 1/2 a generation ago .	SurferJoe46 (51)
567955	2007-07-15 21:19:00	Come to my fathers village in Suntong then Joe. Tell me if it's safe to even touch the water.:rolleyes: Or if you can even stand the smell.	bob_doe_nz (92)
567956	2007-07-16 06:14:00	We have garbage-y areas here too..but I think for the most part, China is pretty remarkable.	SurferJoe46 (51)
567957	2007-07-16 08:30:00	To cut short and make it very simple: STOP BUYING ALL PRODUCTS FROM CHINA!:D	bk T (215)
567958	2007-07-16 09:28:00	We have garbage-y areas here too..but I think for the most part, China is pretty remarkable. Really depends on your definition of "remarkable" Joe. It's certainly not a "remarkably" clean or plesant place overall.	somebody (208)
567959	2007-07-16 09:41:00	Come to my fathers village in Suntong then Joe. Tell me if it's safe to even touch the water.:rolleyes: Or if you can even stand the smell. I do belief what you said is very true. Coincidently, there are places in Otahuhu which I personally think that it is unfit for human to live in (in terms of NZ standard of living). It's just hard to belief that there are such places with such kind of living conditions in Auckland, New Zealand! What I'm trying to say here is: There are such kind of places in every country in this world, including the USA. So, just don't be alarmed when you see or hear something like that. It's nothing unusual, just too common.	bk T (215)
567960	2007-07-16 11:52:00	Coincidently, there are places in Otahuhu which I personally think that it is unfit for human to live in (in terms of NZ standard of living). Yeah, the stream that goes below the motorway/DB breweries. The creek thats behind Monterey Ave in Otahuhu (literally a dumping ground for lazy buggers) And the Asia Restaurant... :yuck: :yuck: :yuck: :yuck: :yuck: How people can eat at a place like that is beyond me. You won't see me there even with a barge pole. Roaches in your food, toilets that probably have never been cleaned before... *shudders* Oh and the toilets in Stage one of Sylvia Park. YUCK Especially on weekends. Thank goodness no-one knows where the ones in Stage Two are.	bob_doe_nz (92)
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