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Thread ID: 81525	2007-07-30 07:04:00	Smacking Law	pctek (84)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
574236	2007-07-30 23:32:00	It's always someone else's fault. Largely it's the under class that carry out these heinous crimes,and what creates the under class,nanny state.	Cicero (40)
574237	2007-07-31 03:06:00	I understand why they created a law where smacking is considered wrong and unlawful . I personally don't have too much against a smack on the bum even though its not something I find I need to do . Watching the interviews on the news and hearing the same speeches made from the same people about how something needs to be done . . . . but what . My concern about this law and all the T . V coverage is simple . . . . . . Pressure . . . . . I cant even remember who said it but I think everyone is thinking it . . . . . why didn't the neighbors do anything, how could they sit by and do and say nothing . I'm not going to use this latest case as an example as I don't not know what happened but . . . . If you hear a child screaming, what do you do? If you see a child curled up outside in a corner, what do you do? Imagine being a parent who's scared of their child packing a sad . Imagine if you are a parent who's scared of their child screaming out of joy or perhaps having stubbed their toe . Imagine being a parent who's neighbor comes over to find out if your beating your child when they are just throwing a tantrum over not being allowed a lolly etc . Imagine being a parent who's child is going through a screaming out of spite stage and CYFS rocks up and asks if you have been beating your child . It does happen . My son was 5, he has Aspergers and has always had a hate for water . I went to put him in the shower one day and he screamed his little head off . The neighbors didn't come and accuse me of beating my child, instead they called CYFS . They come to my door . It is the most humiliating, disgusting, life wrenching thing to ever happen to me . They had to contact the school, my family because the account from the neighbors was so damning . (he was screaming for ages) . You may say that its better than letting a child be beat but for me its something I will live in fear of for the rest of my life . The fear of some stranger taking the word of another stranger instead of mine and then taking away my child . Luckily the case was thrown out due to a great report form the school and family but . . . . it could have easily gone bad . Is it fair that parents out there are now going to have that kind of pressure added to what is already one of the hardest things they will ever do (parenting) . Some may think so . But the mental hurt from having been accused, wrongly, or the mental thought that you could be accused is something that could damage a family forever . The pressure on parents must be effecting their children in a not so good way . Luckily my son is almost 14 and in all honesty I wouldn't have another child in this day in age because the pressure, the fear would be unbearable . So what do you do? Hear a child scream or yell or cry and confront your neighbor? Let it go cause its probably just some kid packing a sad? Call someone and hope they don't find out its you who called? Now neighbors and communities as well as extended families have the pressure as well as the parents . Don't think there is an easy way out of this one .	never-u-mind (6500)
574238	2007-07-31 03:13:00	I understand why they created a law where smacking is considered wrong and unlawful . I personally don't have too much against a smack on the bum even though its not something I find I need to do . Watching the interviews on the news and hearing the same speeches made from the same people about how something needs to be done . . . . but what . My concern about this law and all the T . V coverage is simple . . . . . . Pressure . . . . . I cant even remember who said it but I think everyone is thinking it . . . . . why didn't the neighbors do anything, how could they sit by and do and say nothing . I'm not going to use this latest case as an example as I don't not know what happened but . . . . If you hear a child screaming, what do you do? If you see a child curled up outside in a corner, what do you do? Imagine being a parent who's scared of their child packing a sad . Imagine if you are a parent who's scared of their child screaming out of joy or perhaps having stubbed their toe . Imagine being a parent who's neighbor comes over to find out if your beating your child when they are just throwing a tantrum over not being allowed a lolly etc . Imagine being a parent who's child is going through a screaming out of spite stage and CYFS rocks up and asks if you have been beating your child . It does happen . My son was 5, he has Aspergers and has always had a hate for water . I went to put him in the shower one day and he screamed his little head off . The neighbors didn't come and accuse me of beating my child, instead they called CYFS . They come to my door . It is the most humiliating, disgusting, life wrenching thing to ever happen to me . They had to contact the school, my family because the account from the neighbors was so damning . (he was screaming for ages) . You may say that its better than letting a child be beat but for me its something I will live in fear of for the rest of my life . The fear of some stranger taking the word of another stranger instead of mine and then taking away my child . Luckily the case was thrown out due to a great report form the school and family but . . . . it could have easily gone bad . Is it fair that parents out there are now going to have that kind of pressure added to what is already one of the hardest things they will ever do (parenting) . Some may think so . But the mental hurt from having been accused, wrongly, or the mental thought that you could be accused is something that could damage a family forever . The pressure on parents must be effecting their children in a not so good way . Luckily my son is almost 14 and in all honesty I wouldn't have another child in this day in age because the pressure, the fear would be unbearable . So what do you do? Hear a child scream or yell or cry and confront your neighbor? Let it go cause its probably just some kid packing a sad? Call someone and hope they don't find out its you who called? Now neighbors and communities as well as extended families have the pressure as well as the parents . Don't think there is an easy way out of this one . Great post . Maybe getting to know your neighbours would help in this day in age . It used to be that way - you'd know everyone in your street - within reason . Now you can sleep 5m away from your neighbour and not even know their name .	wratterus (105)
574239	2007-07-31 03:40:00	Great post never-u-mind, that is exactly what I often think. In your situation though, as wratterus said, it would have been helpful to have been a little friendly with your neighbours so that they knew your situation. Of course, we don't all have neighbours that we wish to be friendly with, however. When my son was five or six he struck up a friendship with an Asian boy in his class and one day the little boy and his mother came and asked if my son could go to their house after school to play. I agreed and arranged to collect him at 5pm. When I arrived I was astonished to discover the boys all alone and locked in the house as the mother had gone off to work just after dropping them at her house. I got both boys to climb out of the window then brought them home with me. The father turned up looking for his kid over an hour later and I explained to him that it is illegal to leave any child under the age of 14 without the supervision of a person 14 and over. He claimed ignorance of this, having only been living in this country for a couple of years but didn't think it was a big deal and that they did it all the time. The next day I went to the school principal and told him of the incident, being as I was concerned that another child might be invited to keep the kid company, and he had a word to the parents. At the time I felt like a real tattle-tale but later I was glad I did because I learnt a few years afterwards that the boys had been playing with lighters. :( :(	FoxyMX (5)
574240	2007-07-31 03:43:00	Great post. Maybe getting to know your neighbours would help in this day in age. It used to be that way - you'd know everyone in your street - within reason. Now you can sleep 5m away from your neighbour and not even know their name. But hear them 'traf' in bed!.... Never-u-mind, what a well thought out post!, I hear you loud and clear..It is a delema for sure. Not too long ago, we wouldn't have to worry about such matters as parenting skills were handed down from the family, extended family. With so many agencies and help centres today, i seems to me there are numerous avenues for young teenagers to leave the family nucleus too early and set off to live ill prepared for a family. Perhaps its too easy with the government hand outs left right and centre. I have thought for a long time, we need parenting classes in school, and maybe even something to try and re-enforce respect for others. I do think there should be banning for some parents who have there children removed from them. I know we all feel it is our right to reproduce, however there are too many that use this as career. I dont think any smacking law will ever protect children as the only people who abide by the laws of the land, have the same moral fiber as those that make the laws. I think we need to tackle the cause, violence in this area will always bred violence. It will be trained in the off-spring, we see it time after time. Working for Families was a great start, we need to get these career mums off the state dependancy, isolate the violence fathers, and start educating the young in life skills before they leave school and start the cycle over.	SolMiester (139)
574241	2007-07-31 05:28:00	I actually did know these neighbors to an extent . I was living there for about 5 months and new the neighbors on the other side really well, my son and their son were good friends . The neighbors in front of me were 2 women flatting together, very work minded etc . I knew them enough to say hi and have small talk with them which is why I was so surprised . At the time I thought it was due to me being a young single mum and they felt I was not coping??? Who knows what thoughts went through their mind . FoxyMX: "When I arrived I was astonished to discover the boys all alone and locked in the house as the mother had gone off to work just after dropping them at her house . I got both boys to climb out of the window then brought them home with me . " I think in a situation like that, there is no other choice but to take a stand, its something that not only affected someone else's child but your own child's safety . SolMiester: "With so many agencies and help centers today, i seems to me there are numerous avenues for young teenagers to leave the family nucleus too early and set off to live ill prepared for a family . Perhaps its too easy with the government hand outs left right and center . Working for Families was a great start, we need to get these career mums off the state dependency, isolate the violence fathers, and start educating the young in life skills before they leave school and start the cycle over . " Hmmmmm . I'm not getting at your post but, not all single mums are dependent on the state, not all violence is by fathers, not all offenders offend because their mum or dads did . I think its great that there is help out there for single (or not) parents who choose to work but . . . . . . . I know, I know . . . . . heaps and heaps of people have a real disregard for people who are on a benefit . There are women/men who lost their partners due to, death, leaving them, what ever . There are people who have the joy of being a parent but sadly suffer from a disability or sickness . There are those who choose to be a parent and are studying to make a better life for themselves and the child/children they brought into this world . Why cant we as a whole be happy with helping out those who are in need . So many people out there who only see the dole bludgers and don't see there are people who need the benefit to become a real part of our society . I know, I know that many will not agree with me but I like the thought of a parent, either one, man or woman, staying at home to help their children grow to be respectful, thoughtful and socially aware . So many children these days are dropped off at 8am and picked up at 6pm Monday to Friday to childcare places, two parent or one parent families who work their buts off to not only live but to pay for this service yet . . . . . there are mothers and fathers out there who just want to give their all to their children and if that means being one of those awful benefit people . . . . so be it? I hear it all the time . . . . . I'm sick of my taxs going to pay for these people to sit on their ass's and do nothing all day . How far have we come in life to complain because parents aren't parenting right and yet they are expected to work, look after the house etc and be the perfect parent . . . . . so much pressure . . . . . I'm sorry I think I just ended up rambling and lost my point somewhere . :stare: :p	never-u-mind (6500)
574242	2007-07-31 05:28:00	nothing. Imagine being a parent who's scared of their child packing a sad. Imagine if you are a parent who's scared of their child screaming out of joy or perhaps having stubbed their toe. Imagine being a parent who's neighbor comes over to find out if your beating your child when they are just throwing a tantrum over not being allowed a lolly etc. Imagine being a parent who's child is going through a screaming out of spite stage and CYFS rocks up and asks if you have been beating your child It does happen. My son was 5, he has Aspergers and has always had a hate for water. .....You may say that its better than letting a child be beat but for me its something I will live in fear of for the rest of my life. The fear of some stranger taking the word of another stranger instead of mine and then taking away my child. Luckily the case was thrown out due to a great report form the school and family but .... it could have easily gone bad. Is it fair that parents out there are now going to have that kind of pressure added to what is already one of the hardest things they will ever do (parenting). Some may think so. But the mental hurt from having been accused, wrongly, or the mental thought that you could be accused is something that could damage a family forever. So what do you do? Hear a child scream or yell or cry and confront your neighbor? Let it go cause its probably just some kid packing a sad? Call someone and hope they don't find out its you who called? Now neighbors and communities as well as extended families have the pressure as well as the parents. Thanks for your moving post. It's a tough one. I guess my view is that because of the violence being suffered by some children it is better for a report to be made than ignore something alarming. But it must be awful to be thought a child abuser when there is a reasonable explanation.	Winston001 (3612)
574243	2007-07-31 05:34:00	I just find it ironic how that guy from the Maori party blames uninvolved parties of all this child abuse. Family A abuses its child. Families B, C, D and E gets the blame too. What the hell? To quote Hillary (The Pillory) Clinton: "It takes a village!"	SurferJoe46 (51)
574244	2007-07-31 05:53:00	Thanks for your moving post . It's a tough one . I guess my view is that because of the violence being suffered by some children it is better for a report to be made than ignore something alarming . But it must be awful to be thought a child abuser when there is a reasonable explanation . It's a tough one . I guess my view is that because of the violence being suffered by some children it is better for a report to be made than ignore something alarming . Totally agree . But it must be awful to be thought a child abuser when there is a reasonable explanation Luckily I thought of myself as a damn good mother . :D I do worry that some parents will allow bad behavior so they don't end up facing those kinds of suggestions, could lead to some very negative effects for children and how they react to society . Anyway enough of my long winded postings . I think Ive said more than my share lol . :thumbs:	never-u-mind (6500)
574245	2007-07-31 05:57:00	It's always someone else's fault. Largely it's the under class that carry out these heinous crimes,and what creates the under class,nanny state. Ooooooooh, That made me cringe. How far from the facts do you have to get before you fall off your "High Horse"? Your so called "Nanny State" is about ridding society of class based inequality. I guess when you get to vote in the next election you will vote for the currency trader (John Key) and salivate over the $10 a week you may or may not get in Tax Cuts then you will, no doubt, carry on about the "lower Classes" having had it too good for the last 12 years and demand we bring back hanging for dole bludgers. Adolf would have loved you.	JackStraw (6573)
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