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Thread ID: 82165	2007-08-17 12:40:00	Cannibals	feersumendjinn (64)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
581987	2007-08-17 12:40:00	www.stuff.co.nz Perhaps our own tangata whenua could follow their example :p:rolleyes:	feersumendjinn (64)
581988	2007-08-17 19:47:00	Perhaps our own tangata whenua could follow their example :p:rolleyes:Meaning? Brown directed and took part in a punitive expedition that resulted in a number of Tolais being killed and several villages burnt down. His actions caused a storm of protest in the Methodist Church in Australia and elsewhere. Official investigations by British colonial authorities in the Pacific cleared him of criminal charges.Seems the colonials got away with quite a lot back then. I wonder when people will start hearing apologies from the British Crown for the actions of their past (and their dodgy lil colonials)? This is sooo gonna get ugly ...	Myth (110)
581989	2007-08-17 20:48:00	www.stuff.co.nz Perhaps our own tangata whenua could follow their example :p:rolleyes: I believe that's a troll. Remember, don't feed the little troll - or he'll get bigger.	Deane F (8204)
581990	2007-08-17 21:08:00	Appreciate where you're coming from Myth, but if you quote your second quote in context, readers could better see the reason for the 'punitive expedition'. Yes, the colonials got away with what seems a lot back then, but we shouldn't assign 21st century mores and morals to 18th century actions - they were acting in what they thought at the time was the natives' best interests (and so I bet did the Tolai cannibals!). Perhaps if the colonials hadn't been there at all the world would be a different - not necessarily better - place now. But pretty pointless going down that hypothetical track. Which is also why I think apologies by any current party for any actions carried out by ancestor parties long dead are a total waste of time and energy (given that they cost nothing - for that reason they are worth nothing). I am NOT responsible for my ancestors actions and do not expect my children to be responsible for my actions. [Waitangi Tribunal take note!]	johcar (6283)
581991	2007-08-18 03:57:00	What I meant was, the Maoris are always going on about "their land" being stolen by the white man, and how we must all apologise (by the government on our behalf), and pay them compensation etc. How about them apologising for, say, what happened to the Chatham Island Moriori (conquered, killed and eaten, and their land stolen). What gives them the right to be critical of the rest of the population of New Zealand, they 'Once Were Headhunters' for goodness sake (chances are they ate missionaries too). It sometimes seems to me, that a lot of people dont want to discuss this sort of thing (politically incorrect, scared, disgusted etc) but its part of our history (where do you think the shrunken heads in Te Papa Museum came from?) and should be 'owned' by the people responsible. Perhaps this is why some treat their kids as they do (some sense of historical shame?). (Sorry in advance if this offends somebody, just wanted to speak my mind). :annoyed: :2cents:	feersumendjinn (64)
581992	2007-08-18 04:19:00	Which is also why I think apologies by any current party for any actions carried out by ancestor parties long dead are a total waste of time and energy (given that they cost nothing - for that reason they are worth nothing). I agree with you to a certain extent, but my point is, it does cost all of us hundreds of millions of dollars, that definitely could be better spent.	feersumendjinn (64)
581993	2007-08-18 04:34:00	We keep on making the mistake of judging 18th &19 Century actions by todays standards, and this is quite fallacious. By the standards of the 19th century the NZ Maori got a very good deal - especially in comparison to the Australian aborigine and the North American Indian, or the tribes of Africa. Before we sit in judgement on the 19th century British treatment of the Maori, perhaps we should look at how minor criminals were treated within the English system of that time. Capital punishment featured as punishment for nearly 700 offences, including stealing goods in excess of the value of 2 pounds. For lesser offences deportation to Australia was a common consequence. I would recommend Robert Hugh's excellent book "The Fatal Shore" for anyone who wants to get an insight into the treatment dished out to their own by the British. And to this one can add such minor events as the Irish Potato Famine and the Highland Clearances. It was not exactly a barrel of fun being on the lower rungs of the social ladder at that time, life was tough and frequently brutal. When one has has digested this, remember that the English were probably one of the more enlightened and liberal societies in Europe at that time. The tangata whenua should thank their lucky stars that it was the British and not the French, Dutch or Belgians that claimed New Zealand as a colony.	KenESmith (6287)
581994	2007-08-18 05:54:00	Apologising for things people did before your lifetime is pointless . Fighting over thing that happened before your lifetime is pointless . Yet NZ do it everyday . . . . . everyone must pay($) for settlements etc Humourous	rob_on_guitar (4196)
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