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Thread ID: 83546	2007-10-05 11:06:00	Jury penalises music file-sharer	legod (4626)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
598296	2007-10-07 06:21:00	The reference to v11 and the results of this scamsuit was on Leo Laporte today (Sat show/US) and he's been on a rip against M$ and v11 too . . . just like me . We suspect all and believe little when it comes to M$ and things RIAA/MPAA/Bill-O But the spyware in v11 is well known and the WGA-WDRM thing is where it's all at right now . Since v11 requires WDRMs and such to allow play, and grabs the files for itself . . . . as it seems to do right now . . . it's only obvious that there's a future shock involved . The reason I say this is that with this new legal precedent, the door's open now to spy and hang people with UN-DRM'd file son their system . . . like home movies and your niece's piano practice piece she attached to you in an e-mail . This is just a tip of iceberg thing I feel . I'd like to be wrong . . but I don't think so . . . not this time . One M$ concession was the IE7 upgrade without the need of WGA . . that's a shock! The learning curve for PCLinuxOS 2007 forms over there —>	SurferJoe46 (51)
598297	2007-10-07 06:40:00	Movies and music (individual tracks rather than whole CDs) Individual tunes are not distributed via Torrents, Its either full albums or entire discographies. Bands outside of the mainstream are actually capable of making a solid album or even a decade or two worth of solid albums, rather then a couple of singles and a bunch of filler.	Metla (12)
598298	2007-10-07 07:03:00	I recall an ISP guy saying that the share of Bit Torrent traffic at his ISP was now over 65% of all internet traffic. I wonder what everyone is sharing? Digital copies of the bible ? Whilst I sympathise with the woman I also have a little sympathy for the record companies. There are only a few industries that are exposed to interest piracy eg music, videos. How would you like it if you are say a panel beater and everyone started getting their panel beating done on the internet ? downloading a front fender etc. But against that the record companies have to realise that this is not the 60's and 70's when young people bought an LP (CD) every week ! Nowadays there many other things to spend disposable income on eg computer games. Whilst everyone keeps on about the rip off prices fro CD';s (the pricing of which is fairly universal world-wide) what about the far worse rip off here in NZ of mobile phone calls to and from landlines. We are just about the dearest in the world for this as Telecom and Vodaphone and the Commerce Commission and David Cunliffe all know well. Regards Digby	Digby (677)
598299	2007-10-07 08:08:00	DULUTH, Minnesota -- Here, in no particular order, are the 24 tracks that cost Jammie Thomas $222,000 -- making it perhaps the most valuable hour-and-a-half of music ever. * Guns N Roses "Welcome to the Jungle"; "November Rain" * Vanessa Williams "Save the Best for Last" * Janet Jackson "Let's What Awhile" * Gloria Estefan "Here We Are"; "Coming Out of the Heart"; "Rhythm is Gonna Get You" * Goo Goo Dolls "Iris" * Journey "Faithfully"; "Don't Stop Believing" * Sara McLachlan "Possession"; "Building a Mystery" * Aerosmith "Cryin'" * Linkin Park "One Step Closer" * Def Leppard "Pour Some Sugar on Me" * Reba McEntire "One Honest Heart" * Bryan Adams "Somebody" * No Doubt "Bathwater"; "Hella Good"; "Different People" * Sheryl Crow "Run Baby Run" * Richard Marx "Now and Forever" * Destiny's Child "Bills, Bills, Bills" * Green Day "Basket Case"	limepile (96)
598300	2007-10-07 09:06:00	A little US law here . What happened here was a total sham . The woman was not proven to be the downloader . She alluded to a grandchild or something, and that she (the woman) could not be proved to have downloaded the files and THAT should have thrown the case out of court . I'm not saying that she wasn't guilty . . . she prolly was . . but that's a moot point of law . It is part of the initial INVESTIGATION, but not for penalty and prosecution that her IP was flagged; there should have had to be a full disclosure and a cease-and-desist order issued to her and her ISP first . Failing that, this was a dog and pony show . It was a lynching . Prima facia evidence as presented was just hearsay and was not really good enough to convict in the first place . The judge misinformed the jury and they fell for the M$ line . She had to actually be caught in the act for this to stick, and she was not . Guilt for just owning a computer with the capacity to download was the argument and legal disclosure laws and logic went out the window . The prosecution's argument was that it was her IP and her ISP and her computer so therefor the downloading was at the hands of "Jane Doe-defense" which is a cover-all alias that is used to indicate that the actual perpetrator has not been named, but will be so at conviction . This was so trumped up that she shouldda walked . . . but the jury said they were totally convinced that she had broken laws and statutes of the US trademark and registry act . On the allegations alone, this should never have gotten to the court in the first place . The US Bill of Rights demands full evidential disclosure, and this too was not allowed . Her attorney was blindsided and hobbled by special instructions from the judge . What YOUSE guys don't see was that a lot of the "evidence" gathered was from her use of WMP as a player in her machine . . and it reported back to M$ that there's dirty work afoot on her puter . Guilty as she might have been or not, this gathered evidence was without a judges signed warrant and none was provided or issued . Internet traffic to a P2P, warez, and/or Limewire was reported by her ISP as the next nail in her coffin . There never was a search warrant issued to get that information . . . it was "threatened out" of her provider by RIAA/MPAA attorneys . This is absolutely guilt by association . It is not in any way sufficient for a conviction . . . . . . however it IS sufficient for an investigation with legal warrants and court orders if they have been issued . It's akin to wiretapping without a warrant: legal to investigate IF a good case can be built on other or subsequent evidence and not the evidence gathered by the illegal activities . A real judge would throw that out in a heartbeat and fine the information gathering facility too . What youse guys don't seem to understand is that now there is a legal precedent that has been set for this sort of jackbooted investigation and prosecution on a worldwide basis . You are next! It's the WGA/WDRM/RIAA/MPAA goons and their evil spawn that are out to get everyone that lives in countries that have extradition and international trademark/copyright laws with the US . I have been warning youse guys about v11 of THAT media player and some just blindly say: "I like it, it's cool to me" or some such drivel . You are being red-flagged as you use it . You will eventually see that this is very sinister and devious on the part for all concerned . This is a conspiracy that you are failing to note . Paranoid? Yup! And you should be too . How do you know WMP 11 was involved?? Quoting lots of text is a really good idea .	roddy_boy (4115)
598301	2007-10-07 09:31:00	DULUTH, Minnesota -- Here, in no particular order, are the 24 tracks that cost Jammie Thomas $222,000 -- making it perhaps the most valuable hour-and-a-half of music ever. * Guns N Roses "Welcome to the Jungle"; "November Rain" * Vanessa Williams "Save the Best for Last" * Janet Jackson "Let's What Awhile" * Gloria Estefan "Here We Are"; "Coming Out of the Heart"; "Rhythm is Gonna Get You" * Goo Goo Dolls "Iris" * Journey "Faithfully"; "Don't Stop Believing" * Sara McLachlan "Possession"; "Building a Mystery" * Aerosmith "Cryin'" * Linkin Park "One Step Closer" * Def Leppard "Pour Some Sugar on Me" * Reba McEntire "One Honest Heart" * Bryan Adams "Somebody" * No Doubt "Bathwater"; "Hella Good"; "Different People" * Sheryl Crow "Run Baby Run" * Richard Marx "Now and Forever" * Destiny's Child "Bills, Bills, Bills" * Green Day "Basket Case" At least half of those tracks are not even recent releases which is where the biggest "supposed" financial losses from pirating would be sustained from. Totally bogus case.:mad:	winmacguy (3367)
598302	2007-10-07 10:41:00	At least half of those tracks are not even recent releases which is where the biggest "supposed" financial losses from pirating would be sustained from. Totally bogus case.:mad: Yeah - and much of it crap too. Jammie Thomas not so "Jammie" now is she?	legod (4626)
598303	2007-10-07 20:41:00	DULUTH, Minnesota -- Here, in no particular order, are the 24 tracks that cost Jammie Thomas $222,000 -- making it perhaps the most valuable hour-and-a-half of music ever. * Guns N Roses "November Rain" * Vanessa Williams "Save the Best for Last" * Janet Jackson "Let's What Awhile" * Gloria Estefan "Here We Are"; "Coming Out of the Heart"; "Rhythm is Gonna Get You" * Goo Goo Dolls "Iris" * Journey "Faithfully"; "Don't Stop Believing" * Sara McLachlan "Possession"; "Building a Mystery" * Linkin Park "One Step Closer" * Def Leppard "Pour Some Sugar on Me" * Reba McEntire "One Honest Heart" * Bryan Adams "Somebody" * No Doubt "Bathwater"; "Hella Good"; "Different People" * Sheryl Crow "Run Baby Run" * Richard Marx "Now and Forever" * Destiny's Child "Bills, Bills, Bills" * Green Day "Basket Case" Anyone who listens to half of that rubbish should be fined even more	rob_on_guitar (4196)
598304	2007-10-07 21:06:00	I grew up listening to at least half of it. personally I would be more concerned if the woman was the ring leader in a huge money laundering/movie counterfeiting operation involving hundreds of millions of dollars of pirated DVDs - like the guy who was selling Sione's Wedding at the Otara (admittedly on a much smaller scale) markets becasue that type of thing really does hurt the industry especially in this country.	winmacguy (3367)
598305	2007-10-08 00:36:00	More today in our media here in the US . The one glaring problem was the judge instructed the jury to only work the "copyright" laws angle and set the whole case on that . It has been offered by some very prominent US Constitutional attorneys that they will help her file an appeal for free . This is gonna get interesting . She was denied due-process when the judge vandalized the Bill of Rights to the US Constitution . . . . approximately the same legal model NZ follows with our common English heritage . The judge poisoned the jury with his instructions in what they should and not what the could consider . Their hands were tied, and of course they had to say that she had violated the copyright laws . . but that was under the premise that she had actually committed the crime in the first place . It seemed a fore made conclusion the way they heard the testimony . Remember that her attorney was almost held incommunicado . Saying that to the jury made it a slam-dunk that she was already guilty of downloading the files and all they had to adjudicate upon was the copyright part . They skipped over the part of finding her to have been the person who actually committed a crime by downloading the files, and jumped right to the punitive part causing the jury to assume guilt without a preliminary trial . Do you catch this fine point? :stare:	SurferJoe46 (51)
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