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Thread ID: 84499 2007-11-08 04:54:00 Anti Terror? Sweep (90) PC World Chat
Post ID Timestamp Content User
609347 2007-11-08 07:02:00 You're right some of them will be charged for firearm offences instead .

Doesnt mean theyre terrorists tho .

Police / the govt just decided to make it more dramatic .

Yer even tho Mallarrd may have been photographed or recorded on video, was that guy there at the time?

The public may or may not hear anything to do with evidence either .

I know what infringement notices are, I used to deal with them at the court .

You do have the right to defend infringement notices .

You can apply in writing, explaining whatever, and then its up to the cops in Wellington, on whether they'll grant it and remove it .

It depends on HOW you got the infringement in the first place .

It you were caught speeding on camera, how could you deny it?

I think you're getting confused between reparation and Infringement notices . Theyre not the same thing .

Infringements you dont usually go to court . Reparation you do .

Thats when the judge will ask you, how much you can afford to pay back (as in reparation) .

I never said that any person arrested was a terrorist as such .

The Police in NZ should have the right to charge any person(s) under current law .

The Police elected or wanted to charge a number of people under a certain law . This, possibly, to test the law as it stands .

Reparation is an entirely different issue to an infringement .

Let us say that I did exceed the speed limit by 10Kph .

I will get a fine . This fine not adjusted to my income or circumstances .

So Bill Gates drives past my place at 60 Kph and gets a ticket (Infringement)

But Bill has a slightly higher income than I do . An $x fine will probably not hurt him very much .

If I walked out of my home whilst Bill was driving by at 10 Kph over the limit and I was medically damaged as a result? 		Sweep (90)
609348 2007-11-08 07:24:00 Reparation is an entirely different issue to an infringement .

I know, thats what I SAID . Infringements u dont go to court, reparation u do .

You said it not me:

Or not as the case may be . The Magistrate (in the event you defend the matter) used to ask what income have you?

The Judge will ask u how much u can afford for reparation, not for an Infringement .

The registrar at the Fines office may ask you that, not the Judge .


Let us say that I did exceed the speed limit by 10Kph .

I will get a fine . This fine not adjusted to my income or circumstances .

It has NOTHING to do with whether you can afford to pay the fine or not .

It would be a set amount, depending on the offence .

Infringements are minor, compared to major offences .

Its a police matter not the courts .

Which is WHY you dont go to court for an infringement, you get a letter .

Enough said . 		Speedy Gonzales (78)
609349 2007-11-08 07:58:00 So Bill Gates drives past my place at 60 Kph and gets a ticket (Infringement)

But Bill has a slightly higher income than I do. An $x fine will probably not hurt him very much.

Whether or not a $x fine will hurt Bill Gates more than you is not the point of the fine.

$x buys the same amount for Bill Gates as it does for you. Thus, the penalty is the same; for the same crime - and therefore the law has treated you both equally. 		Deane F (8204)
609350 2007-11-08 08:00:00 www.nzherald.co.nz

Big deal - a private prosecution. As far as I know, there has never been a successful one in New Zealand. It'll cost the bloke a lot of money - and will probably not get past depositions. 		Deane F (8204)
609351 2007-11-08 08:02:00 Whether or not a $x fine will hurt Bill Gates more than you is not the point of the fine .

$x buys the same amount for Bill Gates as it does for you . Thus, the penalty is the same; for the same crime - and therefore the law has treated you both equally .

You got it Deane . It wouldnt matter whether you were the Queen, Bill, Tom, Dick or Harry .

You do the crime you pay, and you pay the same amount . For the same offence .

Whether you're rich or poor . 		Speedy Gonzales (78)
609352 2007-11-08 08:07:00 I know, thats what I SAID . Infringements u dont go to court, reparation u do .

You said it not me:

Or not as the case may be . The Magistrate (in the event you defend the matter) used to ask what income have you?

The Judge will ask u how much u can afford for reparation, not for an Infringement .

The registrar at the Fines office may ask you that, not the Judge .



It has NOTHING to do with whether you can afford to pay the fine or not .

It would be a set amount, depending on the offence .

Infringements are minor, compared to major offences .

Its a police matter not the courts .

Which is WHY you dont go to court for an infringement, you get a letter .

Enough said .

I agree that there is a set amount . Now most people just pay the fine for the allleged offence and please note that that the offence is ALLEGED

Now any offence may have to be proven in the event I take the matter to court . I can take it to court in the event I get a letter I believe .

I like your idea of Police matter . Had you not noticed that the police are not always correct and this is why we have a court?

I agree that the police matter should be put before a court . Once upon a time you could take the matter to the Privy Council .

You might think enough is said .

I think that more is said than done .

Should we believe that the Police are always correct and so therefore get rid of all courts . 		Sweep (90)
609353 2007-11-08 08:22:00 I agree that there is a set amount . Now most people just pay the fine for the allleged offence and please note that that the offence is ALLEGED

Correct . BUT, if you think theyre wrong, do something about it .

It depends on where and HOW you got the infringement . ie: If a camera snapped your plate, (even tho you werent driving), you could appeal against the fine .

Write to the Police (the court would give u their address) . Explain you werent the driver, explain where you were .

And get witnesses to sign your letter . (And phone #'s may help) .

So, the Police can get confirmation .

And the Police may withdraw the fine .

And if the Police dont agree, give the fine to whoever was driving . So they can pay it .


Now any offence may have to be proven in the event I take the matter to court . I can take it to court in the event I get a letter I believe .

You could, but then the court (there are registrars within the court, who deal with infringements, would pass it onto the Police) . Or tell you to write a letter .

I doubt it would end up in court . As its a minor offence . The court have more important crimes to deal with .


I like your idea of Police matter . Had you not noticed that the police are not always correct and this is why we have a court?

Youre right they're not always right .

BUT since its a Police matter (infringements) . As above it wont go before a court . Its between you and the Police, NOT you the Police and a Judge . 		Speedy Gonzales (78)
609354 2007-11-08 08:24:00 Whether or not a $x fine will hurt Bill Gates more than you is not the point of the fine .

$x buys the same amount for Bill Gates as it does for you . Thus, the penalty is the same; for the same crime - and therefore the law has treated you both equally .

May I ask? What would deter Bill? What is the point of the fine?

So therefore Bill can do what he likes like the boy racers here that do not actually pay anyway .

The point of a fine or imprisionment should be to deter people from commiting an offence in the first place . 		Sweep (90)
609355 2007-11-08 08:37:00 May I ask? What would deter Bill? What is the point of the fine?

The point is its the law.

You speed you pay a fine, you may get disqualified from driving, it goes on your criminal record, do it too many times, you wont have a car. Or you'll go to jail. Confiscating the car might deter Bill, altho, there's nothing stopping him from getting another car.

BUT whether he'll get another licence is another matter.


So therefore Bill can do what he likes like the boy racers here that do not actually pay anyway.

No, he cant do what he likes, coz he's rich. If he breaks the law, he pays like anyone else. Boy racers pay if they get caught speeding or if theyre burning up somewhere.


The point of a fine or imprisonment should be to deter people from committing an offence in the first place.

True but normally on your first offence (if its your first offence), you dont usually go to jail for a driving offence (Unless maybe you kill someone).
You may get a fine or disqualified (depending on the offence).

And after so many times you will go to prison. BUT, some people just dont learn or listen. Thats why they keep going to prison. 		Speedy Gonzales (78)
609356 2007-11-08 08:38:00 In Finland they fine you on a scale according to your income.
They have very low crime there anyway.
The above argument is not logical Gates is a nerd/geek. Geeks/Nerds generally dont speed because with coke bottle lensed glasses they wear they cant see the road ahead that well.

C1 		chicken one (6501)
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