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Thread ID: 86114	2008-01-04 02:14:00	Heat Pump Hot Water Cylinders	somebody (208)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
627363	2008-01-05 01:39:00	Hi there, I work for a company that imports and distributes Gas Continuous Flow Hot Water (CFHW) systems. Not the 2 brands that have been discussed here but still a very well known brand. The uptake of these sytems is increasing substantially as Kiwis begin to understand that electricity is not needed for what is a very simple function. i.e. water heating. If used correctly there is substantial savings in running costs versus electric storage systems. Using LPG or Natural Gas as a direct fuel source has significant benefits to the country in terms of emmisions annd efficencies versus using gas to fire power stations then transmit the electricity to heat the water, in fact with the governments energy strategy (90% reliant on renewable energy) electricity prices will continue to increase from now on. Using heat pumps to heat water makes some sense but don't get caught up in the effecency argument, it is the running costs that count. With electricity prices increasing for the forseeable future this will impact any electric system. I read an article recently that questioned the effectiveness of solar water systems. The head of the Solar Energy Association stated that solar hot water should be used as a secondary system only. NZ climate doesn't allow for it to be the primary source due to the lack of efective sunlight. The capital cost is high especially when a boost (electric or gas) is needed to heat the water when the clouds are two thick. there is some questions over legionella with solar in that the water may not be heated to kill all the bugs. Gas running costs are impacted by the length of the showers as indicated earlier, this is easily overcome with a system temperature controller, usually situated in the kitchen and simply decreasing the temp after your daughter has had her shower means she will get out. cheers	DT33 (12171)
627364	2008-01-05 03:37:00	Hi there, I work for a company that imports and distributes Gas Continuous Flow Hot Water (CFHW) systems. Not the 2 brands that have been discussed here but still a very well known brand. The uptake of these sytems is increasing substantially as Kiwis begin to understand that electricity is not needed for what is a very simple function. i.e. water heating. If used correctly there is substantial savings in running costs versus electric storage systems. Using LPG or Natural Gas as a direct fuel source has significant benefits to the country in terms of emmisions annd efficencies versus using gas to fire power stations then transmit the electricity to heat the water, in fact with the governments energy strategy (90% reliant on renewable energy) electricity prices will continue to increase from now on. Using heat pumps to heat water makes some sense but don't get caught up in the effecency argument, it is the running costs that count. With electricity prices increasing for the forseeable future this will impact any electric system. I read an article recently that questioned the effectiveness of solar water systems. The head of the Solar Energy Association stated that solar hot water should be used as a secondary system only. NZ climate doesn't allow for it to be the primary source due to the lack of efective sunlight. The capital cost is high especially when a boost (electric or gas) is needed to heat the water when the clouds are two thick. there is some questions over legionella with solar in that the water may not be heated to kill all the bugs. Gas running costs are impacted by the length of the showers as indicated earlier, this is easily overcome with a system temperature controller, usually situated in the kitchen and simply decreasing the temp after your daughter has had her shower means she will get out. cheers How cruel.	Cicero (40)
627365	2008-01-05 03:42:00	This is the modern version of the old califont you might have had over the bath in your old flat . Nowadays, they can supply hot water to the whole house, with the burner lighting automatically whenever any hot tap is turned on . The water temperature is thermostatically controlled and can be set to a safe 55°C . Some models are computer controlled and turn the heat up or down according to the amount of hot water being drawn off . Some even have remote control panels so you can set the temperature near the point of use . There are no standing heat losses, as no hot water is stored . Continuous flow systems have a limit on flow rate and a shower may lose flow if other hot taps are turned on in the house . Consult with your supplier about the correct size of water heater for your needs . Continuous flow systems are likely to be the most expensive of the gas options to buy and install, but the cheapest to run . As with all gas options, the larger your family, the more cost-efficient they become . With gas already connected you should be making savings after eight to twelve years, depending on hot water usage . But a continuous flow system is not financially viable if you have to get the gas laid on . The main attractions: endless hot water, saves space . Disadvantages: With some models electricity is needed for the controls, so a power cut means no hot water . People with a continuous flow unit relish the unlimited supply of hot water so much their hot water usage increases! . . But there is a downside . Installation involves dedicated heavy-duty wiring back to the switchboard . And you'll only get around 4 . 4 litres of water per minute . It's not a lot . . .	Cicero (40)
627366	2008-01-05 03:43:00	What do you mean, "How cruel"? Sounds a great idea to me. I like sneaky. Oh, the marvels and miracles of the 21st century	Roscoe (6288)
627367	2008-01-05 03:47:00	What do you mean, "How cruel"? Sounds a great idea to me. I like sneaky. Oh, the marvels and miracles of the 21st century I have many faults,sneaky is not one of them.	Cicero (40)
627368	2008-01-05 03:48:00	Thanks everyone. Getting natural gas connected isn't really an option, due to cost. I was looking at the HomePack LPG systems from Rockgas, but haven't yet got a quote yet so am unsure of cost.	somebody (208)
627369	2008-01-05 04:36:00	Hi again, rough estimate of fully installed LPG twin pack with unit would be around $3000 plus GST Cicero unsure how you work your payback of 8 to 12 years, i don't agree with this. In fact a lot of what you have stated is wrong, flow rates are a lot more than 4 -5 litres, models start from 5 litres to 30 litres per minute (agree that this is cut back depending on temp set etc) theres no need for heavy dytu wiring. CFHW is on a par with gas or electrical storage to buy and install. Remember my bias though when reading this. cheers	DT33 (12171)
627370	2008-01-05 05:09:00	Regarding the heavy wiring, I think he was talking about models that use electricity for the heating, rather than those that just use electricity as an ignition source for gas. And unless you have one hell of a supply, electrically-heated models do have a rather low flow rate. Gas ones are much better, as DT33 has stated above :thumbs:.	Erayd (23)
627371	2008-01-05 05:45:00	Hi again, rough estimate of fully installed LPG twin pack with unit would be around $3000 plus GST Cicero unsure how you work your payback of 8 to 12 years, i don't agree with this. In fact a lot of what you have stated is wrong, flow rates are a lot more than 4 -5 litres, models start from 5 litres to 30 litres per minute (agree that this is cut back depending on temp set etc) theres no need for heavy dytu wiring. CFHW is on a par with gas or electrical storage to buy and install. Remember my bias though when reading this. cheers Any idea of approximate LPG tank refill costs, and how many an average family would go through per year, if gas was only used for hot water?	somebody (208)
627372	2008-01-05 06:36:00	The smallest HWC holds 135 litres, what is your daughter doing in there that she can empty that?!! And people promoting their companies products should learn to spell.	pctek (84)
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