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Thread ID: 88371	2008-03-25 05:19:00	Boycot Beijing Olympics	SolMiester (139)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
652583	2008-03-26 06:32:00	No Western leader is interested as China does not sell oil, look how long it took for them to intervene in the Balkans? :illogical	gary67 (56)
652584	2008-03-26 07:04:00	I voted no. In the event a New Zealand person gets selected in his/her chosen sport then that person should be allowed to go to China if they want to. After all, most have worked hard to get selected in the first place. I will go further and suggest that they should at least be able communicate with other contestants all over the world and have the right of free speech to any people they meet. You may be better off having a boycott as an individual when you go shopping. Only buy products made in New Zealand for example. But then whom in New Zealand does much in the way of manufacturing any more?	Sweep (90)
652585	2008-03-26 07:16:00	I can't get a bus or train from LA to China, so I guess it's outta my travel options. Maybe if I tightly roll up the windows on my car and hit the water at a very high speed.........Are there any gas stations somewhere at about the 300 mile marks across the Pacific? :thumbs:	SurferJoe46 (51)
652586	2008-03-26 08:12:00	I'm putting my weight behind a boycott of Tibet. Damn hippies.	Metla (12)
652587	2008-03-26 09:06:00	It's not so much of Tibet vs China (they ARE one nation anyway). It's the Western nations especially USA, France, UK vs China. Look at how CNN and BBC manipulated those pictures to make up a false story about the recent Tibet incident. Those Tibetant burnt houses, shops, cars, etc, can you call this "Peaceful Protests"? One German TV station has already admitted and apologised to China! Come on, give China a break! China is definitely not a thread to the world but USA is. Just take a look at the Korea war in the 50's, Vietnam War in the late 60's and now the Iraq war. How many civilians were killed (still killing in Iraq) either directly or indirectly by the American & the Alliance soldiers? I know there're about 4,000+ Americans were killed so far in Iraq - that is reported; but why there isn't any or very little reports on the Iraqis that were killed? Mind you, those Iraqis were civilians not soldiers! And most importantly, the Iraqis are humans like you and me! Where is Human Rights?	bk T (215)
652588	2008-03-26 10:24:00	NO, China and Tiber are NOT one nation. China took over Tibet forcefully. Its like saying that Taiwan and China are one nation too.	beeswax34 (63)
652589	2008-03-26 15:21:00	. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Just take a look at the Korea war in the 50's, Vietnam War in the late 60's and now the Iraq war . How many civilians were killed (still killing in Iraq) either directly or indirectly by the American & the Alliance soldiers? I know there're about 4,000+ Americans were killed so far in Iraq - that is reported; but why there isn't any or very little reports on the Iraqis that were killed? Mind you, those Iraqis were civilians not soldiers! And most importantly, the Iraqis are humans like you and me! Where is Human Rights? I am not making apologies for or condemnation against any of the players or attendees in the "wars" . . . I try to remain politically neutral, at least that's my goal . I think there are some things that escape the average eye in the case of any war being fought on somebody's home turf . Take the Revolutionary War on the American continent when British troops were trying to suppress the revolt of the people who wanted to get out from under the control of the British monarchy . One of the biggest complaints by the red-uniformed English armies was that the inconsiderate civilians didn't fight fairly . The locals would hide behind bushes and trees, not wearing any formal uniforms and would shoot at the rank and file Brit troops in their "Four-Square" ranks, picking them off at will and with no warnings . . . no drums or bagpipes or gauntlet across a face . The point? The "locals" had the advantage of home turf and could and WOULD use that to their advantage against the far from home soldiers . During average times of the day many would be farmers and businessmen and at other advantageous times they were soldiers . The individual losses of English and to their paid-for troops (Hessians and others) were enumerated quite well, as the invaders knew how many troops they sent to the place (remember they were sent on boats and had shipping orders and manifests to cypher the losses when they didn't show up for the return trip) . . . . but the civilian head count was never clear . Attrition-from-battle rates for the Colonial "civilians" were never correct nor fairly counted as there was no real standing army in the US shores to muster their names . For all intents and purposes, they were home and just faded into the ground (literally in their grave, marked or not) and many times the families never reported to anyone what had happened . Retribution was great for any family that had a dead rebel in it's roster, so mum was the word . There are still great numbers of unnamed graves in the colonial areas that hosted much of the Revolutionary War . It was so confusing that the term "guerrilla warfare" became coined and the ideas and techniques of warfare were changed forever . Somebody was not fighting with Queensberry rules! Imagine the frustration to the Brits! VietNam was the same thing, only reversed for the US troops . THEY were now the interlopers and the indigenous persons had the home turf and could fight from cover of their own jungles and hooches . The locals were in the markets in the daytime and in the jungles at night . . . picking off the invaders . Example: The My Lai Massacre . . where US troop frustration was so large that they performed atrocious acts against the indigenous persons whom by day were peasants and by night were black pajamaed soldiers with deadly effect and accuracy . " . . . where . . . . US soldiers went berserk, gunning down unarmed men, women, children and babies . Families which huddled together for safety in huts or bunkers were shown no mercy . Those who emerged with hands held high were murdered . . . . Elsewhere in the village, other atrocities were in progress . Women were gang raped; Vietnamese who had bowed to greet the Americans were beaten with fists and tortured, clubbed with rifle butts and stabbed with bayonets . Some victims were mutilated with the signature "C Company" carved into the chest . By late morning word had got back to higher authorities and a cease-fire was ordered . My Lai was in a state of carnage . Bodies were strewn through the village . That wasn't "normal" warfare . It wasn't right and it certainly was not to the rules . . . but the first endorsement to ANY human activity is to try to find the motivation to the act . If you can find the reason why someone . . . or some ONES act the way they do, then you can have an inkling to what was going on under cover of spinmeisters and the media . Those acts were so far out of the realm of normalcy . . if was can be considered normal . . . that there had to be a greater reason for it's happenstance . I digressed . Same with Iraq . The locals have the game field advantage again and they don't wear uniforms nor do they assemble in ranks to meet the aggressors . Guerrilla warfare is the style yet, and of course it's always to the local advantage . Small children run into a group of GIs and set off a belt full of fragmentation grenades, Roadside bombs and other weapons of the moment are taking a huge toll on lots of people . . . army and civilian . Suicide bombers also have little concern for anyone who is not of their religious persuasion and they take quite a few innocents with them in their rampage . Frustration levels are again very high . The armies are not fighting a foe in uniforms . They are trying to decide by looking into the eyes of everyone, trying to discern who it is that will try to kill them or everyone in the marketplace . One can recognize a uniformed warrior . . . but a civilian in a robe and looking like everyone else in the local domain is very hard to differentiate from a secret soldier . My point? War sucks . Police actions suck . People dying sucks really big . But . . . the "civilians" mentioned in the replies are not really civilians at all . They are a militia and they are doing what any home team would do . . . after all they can set the rules of combat . It's totally impossible to accurately compare the head count of the ranked military with the attrition rate of the local people . They may be civilians at times; soldiers at other times . When YOU are a civilian fighting for what you consider a just and right cause, then you too would use any and all underhanded maneuvers to outfox the "enemy" of invaders to your land . I heartily condemn all warfare . . especially in the name of god and religion . . . but please, be tactful and more accurate in your assumptions . Things haven't changed . . . even though the arenas do . . . . yet there are never any lessons learned . Mankind has not found a clearly fair and righteous way to police and govern itself in all it's ill-fated attempts yet . War is usually or always the result and there are dead and dying and hate and fish-mongering on all fronts . In a bigger view, I guess the arena hasn't changed either . We all live on Earth . . . our only and biggest arena .	SurferJoe46 (51)
652590	2008-03-26 20:09:00	NO, China and Tiber are NOT one nation. China took over Tibet forcefully. Its like saying that Taiwan and China are one nation too. You are completely wrong! Taiwan & Tibet are part of China - internationally recognised.	bk T (215)
652591	2008-03-26 20:36:00	You are completely wrong! Taiwan & Tibet are part of China - internationally recognised. Are they? Lets ask Tibet shall we?	Metla (12)
652592	2008-03-26 20:58:00	I seem to remember that the Olympic Committee got tired of boycotts and started a new rule. If you boycott the next Olympic games then you are also barred from the next TWO Olympics also. If that rule is still in force I really do not want to see us stopped from the British based Olympics etc. I do not like what China is doing in Tibet, but also recognize that unlike many people I do know that China has a historical right to regard Tibet as part of China They seem to be making some improvements in Tibet and even have a railway there now. Tibet itself has put up with monks sitting on their backsides all day and chanting happily away, while supported by the rest of those prepared to work. Lets face it they have been running the country for thousands of years, whereas countries like NZ Aussie and America have made massive improvements in a few hundred. I would be happier to see those monks start doing some decent work and research for a change. Perhaps then the appalling video I watched recently where NZ volunteers tried their best to help the Tibet people with medical aid, but had to work in incredibly atrocious conditions would no longer be typical. Tom	Thomas01 (317)
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