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| Thread ID: 88561 | 2008-04-01 00:33:00 | When asked to submit your bag for inspection by security upon leaving a retail store | legod (4626) | PC World Chat |
| Post ID | Timestamp | Content | User | ||
| 654813 | 2008-04-01 02:35:00 | I wouldn't mind - if they had legitimate reason to. If it was just a spot check type thing, I would tell them to...well...family forum here. Suck a piece of my anatomy. |
wratterus (105) | ||
| 654814 | 2008-04-01 03:23:00 | Here in the US . . . a store is a private property and the rights to search and arrest are very clear . Merchants can at any time, create a "Citizens' Arrest" . . but they run the risk of false arrest charges being levied against themselves if the charges don't wash . ANY citizen can utilize the same arrest procedure just by declaring it so in a loud voice . You only see this in the movies however . . . it is a rare person who would want to suffer if they are wrong . At any time, the suspect can tell the store to leave them alone . . . and then the store must decide what it wants to do . The person who does steal something must be caught upon exiting the store with the goods for the charge of theft to stick . Anywhere IN the store, even if past the check stand or cashier's area, is still IN the sore and a crime has not been committed . If the store then suspects (vigorously) that someone has stolen merchandise from them, they must wait until the person leaves and at that point there is a supposed clear case of intent to not pay . They may then 1) attempt to restrain the person with necessary force until law authorities arrive and the store representative(s) can press charges of theft, 2) let them go and not prefer charges 3) be ready to answer to false imprisonment counter charges by the person whom they assumed had committed a crime against them but really hasn't . Any laying on of the hands, surrounding or swarming a person, producing an object of abject or implied fear to cause bodily harm (firearm, stick, baton, recoil weapon, shocking device (ie: Taser®), knife or fist that is doubled and drawn above the waist) is considered a physical arrest . Persons who are suspected or thought to have stolen from a store and the store does not want them to enter again, can warn them to not return and they file a complaint against "John or Jane Doe, take a picture of them if possible, print up a description and ban them from entering the store again under threat of "Fraud against an Inn-Keeper" . . . an archaic law, but it works . The ban is enforceable . BTW: the description and pictures, if any, cannot be seen by the general public . . . like: on display at the check stand or anywhere in the general sales/services area of the store . Posting bad checks and their names or account numbers are also forbidden by the Federal Right To Privacy Act, even for repeat criminals and felons . . Even though the parking lot (car park) is outside the store . . . . (constructed BY the store for it's customers, is still considered private property, unless dedicated to the city/town/state for purposes of policing the parking by the legally-empowered police of the immediate jurisdiction, criminal acts upon it and vehicle code enforcement while vehicles are parked or driven thereupon) . . . . . . the police MUST ultimately be involved in any holding or detaining with arrest of a suspect . |
SurferJoe46 (51) | ||
| 654815 | 2008-04-01 03:26:00 | Whether or not a poster is situated at the door stating "conditions of entry" - the fact is that (most of) any store is a public place. (see Parker v British Airways Board [1982] 1 QB 1002 - and other, older cases cited in that case as to the nature of public and private spaces and some of the rights pertaining thereof.) Also, when I purchase something from a shop the contract is completed when I pay for the goods at the checkout - in other words, once I pay for the goods they are mine. I have title to them. So the nature of actually being in a shop - and the nature of buying something there - are two separate issues. Shops might like to give the impression that the "right" to search is somehow part of a contract when you enter the shop - but in actual fact there is no offer, acceptance or consideration or any other contractual component at that point in time. When I leave the store with goods that fairly and squarely belong to me, the onus is hardly on me to prove it to anybody. If anything, the onus is on any person alleging or even suggesting that the goods are not mine to prove that they are not. Searches that take place on leaving a store are consensual. If you refuse there is absolutely nothing that the shop can do unless there is genuine cause to believe that you have stolen something and even then they have no actual rights to search your person or your property. Correct, but there is a place for making everyone's lives a bit easier. While you're not obligated to let them search your bag, the expectation is there - it's not much of an inconvenience. |
Erayd (23) | ||
| 654816 | 2008-04-01 04:51:00 | Correct, but there is a place for making everyone's lives a bit easier. While you're not obligated to let them search your bag, the expectation is there - it's not much of an inconvenience. While what you say is true to some extent, when you enter a store with this policy they are showing an automatic lack of good faith. They're not doing us any favours by displaying goods for tender. They'd like us to think so sometimes, I'm sure.... Do we shoppers have reasonable grounds for expecting to know the cost price of a merchant's goods - just to know that we're not getting ripped off or unfairly profited from? |
Deane F (8204) | ||
| 654817 | 2008-04-01 04:53:00 | they have no actual rights to search your person or your property. So True. That is the law. |
radium (8645) | ||
| 654818 | 2008-04-01 04:59:00 | While what you say is true to some extent, when you enter a store with this policy they are showing an automatic lack of good faith.I disagree there. They're not saying they will be searching all bags, they're simply giving their staff something to point to when requesting a bag search, if they deem it necessary. I have never seen a store that searches *all* bags, generally security staff have pretty good discretion and they will only ask to search those whom they are genuinely suspicious of. Do we shoppers have reasonable grounds for expecting to know the cost price of a merchant's goods - just to know that we're not getting ripped off or unfairly profited from?No. We have reasonable grounds not to be stolen from (e.g. having credit details used in an unauthorised manner by the merchant), but the merchant should be free to charge what they like. Remember that they are in this to make a profit, not to make your life better. It just so happens that the latter is a necessary step to achieving the former. At the end of the day, you are free to go elsewhere, or simply go without 'product x'. My one exception to this opinion would be a monopoly abusing its market position. |
Erayd (23) | ||
| 654819 | 2008-04-01 05:00:00 | Never been asked. | gibler (49) | ||
| 654820 | 2008-04-01 05:46:00 | In Aussie a store I went to, you HAD to show your reciept on exit, and your items you just bought, and a backpack or anything you already had on you. Seems a little stupid, but hey, must work. |
--Wolf-- (128) | ||
| 654821 | 2008-04-01 06:02:00 | Doesn't worry me if asked. In every case but one (and that was a very officious young customs officer), it has been handled with courtesy. If possible, when I enter a store, I will leave a carrier bag with someone else outside. Cheers, Marnie ps...Mr O Y C O found absolutely nothing that hadn't been declared.:D |
Marnie (4574) | ||
| 654822 | 2008-04-01 06:36:00 | In Aussie a store I went to, you HAD to show your reciept on exit, and your items you just bought, and a backpack or anything you already had on you. Bunnings, by the sounds of it. |
Deane F (8204) | ||
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