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Thread ID: 99868	2009-05-17 22:33:00	Extended warranties	Metla (12)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
774747	2009-05-17 22:33:00	www.stuff.co.nz	Metla (12)
774748	2009-05-17 23:00:00	Interesting... I did nearly 10 years with the CAB and I can always remember a lecture we had on the Tribunal where the guy said a couple of 2 things that were particularly interesting. (from memory) 1. The Referee does not need to be a lawyer 2. He can actually rule against the law in the interests of fairness. Good idea I thought! Ken	kenj (9738)
774749	2009-05-17 23:05:00	And theres the Key words what constitutes a "reasonable period" under the Act remains a "grey area" . Reasonable Period . Some people think a reasonable period may be 3-4 years others 10-15 . If Consumer Guarantees Act leaves it wide open, of course theres going to be disagreements - as it says its 16 years old - about time for an overhaul and be a bit more accurate . A classic is if an older motherboard blows - the rest of the components are fine, but cant get a board that will take the older parts - the Board may be under warranty and could be replaced with the nearest available part - but the working parts are useless as they wont fit . Edited: the extended warranty is a joke - theres so many restrictions its not worth having . Just a few weeks back - I was at a persons place and they had a laptop they had brought from Noel Leeming - the warranty NL gave them said it doesn't cover the screen failing :confused: Last time I looked the Screen is part of a Laptop .	wainuitech (129)
774750	2009-05-17 23:16:00	Now I'm not being a smart arse, But if the CGA can cover a Dell after 5 years. Doesn't this leave the small computer builder wide open for an even longer period. Since your customer has purchased a real computer and not one from a toaster shop.	plod (107)
774751	2009-05-17 23:38:00	Shouldn't matter who or where the NEW PC is built - Apart from the fact the Big name brands, Dell etc, may use cheaper components in the Budget PC's it still boils down to what is a "reasonable time" . Reasonable time to me would be 4 years . I got asked once by Noel Leeming about how long should a TV last when they tried to sell me the extended warranty ( I didn't want it) - I said I'd be happy if it lasted 5-6 years . AND going back to the point I made - sometimes components simply are not available . Seen it many times with the Dells / HP's and PC Company computers, board blows and the remainder of the parts are fine, BUT they wont fit the newer boards - so they are hopeless .	wainuitech (129)
774752	2009-05-18 00:02:00	The component not being available doesn't matter, they bought a working computer not a bunch of separate components. Not the customers fault if those responsible didn't keep enough spares to keep it going for its expected lifetime., In that case they can replace as many items as required to give the customer what they purchased, a working computer.	Metla (12)
774753	2009-05-18 00:08:00	I had something like this happen about a month ago. Customer bought a Compaq about 4 years ago with an extended warranty. (From the local Retravision store I think) Mainboard died. Warranty would only cover a replacement board. The same board was not available any more and the replacement board would be useless without new CPU & RAM & maybe PSU. Customer not very happy :( So we did some "further testing" and found that the CPU and RAM were "faulty" as well. :p All replaced by warranty in the end :thumbs:	CYaBro (73)
774754	2009-05-18 00:17:00	And the whole point of this thread -"Define a reasonable time" --- Which they cant . "Some people think a reasonable period may be 3-4 years others 10-15" . Like many things that were written up years ago - never been updated . If it had something like - Example: Computer 5 years, TV 10 Years then theres something to go by . Consumer NEEDS to get off their butts and rewrite the act instead of causing unclear confusion . Edited: Regarding warranties - Anyone been into Harvey Normans etc lately - on ALL their electronic devices, PC's TV's they have BIG stickers - WARRANTY DOES NOT cover faults caused by Electrical damage (or words to that effect) in other words power surges /spikes .	wainuitech (129)
774755	2009-05-18 01:37:00	The problem with a set in stone period is due to the belief that what you pay for the item has a bearing on expected lifetime, So a budget/throwaway dell can't be expected to last as a high quality PC sold at a higher price point* Personally I'd expect 5 to 8years from a mid-range PC, 2 years from a low end or Dell piece of poo. Anything after that is jam. *this of course falls over as a $2500 Dell is an utter piece of **** compared to the killer PC you would get $2500 from a quality PC builder.	Metla (12)
774756	2009-05-18 05:01:00	I asked what is a "reasonable length of time" once . It depends on the product, the use and brand . ie A commercial operation would cause more wear and tear than a domestic use . A "quality" brand is considered to have a longer lifespan than a poor quality item . That more or less gets determined by the referee . Here: Your questions answered When I bought my computer the retailer told me I could upgrade the graphics card on it, but the motherboard doesn't have the right slot . Under the Consumer Guarantees Act (CGA), goods must match their description . The retailer should pay for a new motherboard which can accept a better graphics card or, if this is impossible, provide a refund . How long should repairs take? It depends on the type of problem, and whether parts need to be sent back to the manufacturer . Some retailers tell us they aim to fix problems within two days, but in our opinion two to three weeks is more likely . If you ask how long the repair will take you're entitled to rely on their answer . If they take longer than that time, you have rights under the CGA . Repeated "fixes" of my new DVD-writer haven't worked . Am I entitled to a replacement? Yes . When a fault is serious or cannot be fixed within a reasonable time, you are entitled to a replacement or refund . My six-month old printer has developed a substantial fault that cannot be fixed . I've been offered a refund of half the purchase price because of "depreciation" . Is this fair? No . As long as a fault is sufficiently serious to warrant a refund, and you reported it promptly, the CGA requires that refund to be of the price paid . I've moved away from the town where I bought my computer . Do I have to pay the costs of sending it back for repair? In our opinion, if the repair is covered by the CGA and/or warranty then the customer should not be stung for the cost of freight within New Zealand . We consider freight to be a reasonably foreseeable consequential loss caused by a product fault, which the retailer is liable for . It is reasonably foreseeable that customers move towns . However, this isn't an open chequebook . You should ensure you use the cheapest transport option available to you, and if you have moved overseas you won't have a case at all . I know there's a problem with my computer, but the retailer can't find anything wrong with it . As long as you've identified the problem clearly and given them a reasonable chance to sort it out, you should get it looked at elsewhere . If a different service outlet finds the problem, you can claim the costs back from the original retailer . We use our computer at home for our small business . Are we still protected by the CGA? Probably not . The CGA covers products ordinarily bought for domestic or personal use . These days there's not much difference between a home computer and a business one . However, when goods are bought for commercial use the retailer has the right to contract out of the CGA (which they must do in writing at the time of purchase, for it to be effective) . Most do . However, even if you're not covered by this Act, you may still have rights under the Sale of Goods Act . I want to bill the retailer for the hundred hours I've spent dealing with my unstable computer . Wasted time and stress is frustrating, but under the CGA you can only claim compensation if you offered the trader the opportunity to fix the problem early on, and can also show an actual consequential loss in monetary terms . Unfortunately "my time is valuable" doesn't usually count . Even if you use your computer for business and have lost clients or contracts because of downtime, the CGA won't entitle you to compensation, because this is a business issue outside the scope of the Act . My faulty mouse can't be replaced because it is now obsolete . You can choose between a refund of the purchase price or a similar model of the same value . If you opt for a similar model costing more you'll have to pay the difference . The retailer has agreed to replace my printer, as it cannot be fixed . But can I keep it as well as the new one? No . Consumers can't have their cake and eat it too! My monitor developed a fault just after the warranty expired . The CGA is not limited by manufacturers' warranties . It says goods must work properly for a reasonable length of time . Ask the manufacturer or other traders for their estimate of a reasonable lifespan for your monitor, then - if yours should still be in the prime of life - make the case to your retailer for a free repair . You can also have a look at our Appliance life expectancy report to see what we think . If a computer part is replaced under warranty does the warranty period start afresh? Not usually . But the new part is subject to the CGA's requirement for goods to be durable, which takes into account their age . While my computer was away being fixed the technician reinstalled Windows, overwriting several of my important files . All service providers have to use reasonable care and skill when fixing things . If you weren't warned that your files would be deleted, and can show monetary loss, the company should compensate you . However, you will probably find it very hard to prove your case, and most files like photos are priceless . Always back-up your important files before handing over your computer . A laptop I bought for university study had problems from the outset . Can I get a temporary replacement while it's being fixed? Retailers do not have to offer stand-ins during repair time . However, if you can prove that your laptop is essential for urgent assignments or exams, and is the only option available, we think you've got a good case for claiming back the costs of renting one . Remember to ask the retailer for a stand-in first . --------- I just rang F&P about my 3 yr old oven - the main seals are stuffed . They said, too bad its out of warranty and we could maybe fix it if the techs report indicates a manufacturing fault but I have to pay for this report . Bollocks . Rang the retailer (as I should), Noel Leeming next . Sales girl more or less said the same a s F& P, I told her if she wasn't familiar with the G CGA she should go fetch her manager . He rang me back and is sending out the repair agenst (under warranty) and then will chase up F&P for me . He agrees 3 yrs isn't a "reasonable time" . --------- Its a tricky area, basically as I tell my customers I only use quality parts in PCs (ASUS, GB, etc etc) then they could hassle me past the warranty period for replacement parts . And I'd have to provide them too . Even though my supplier wouldn't accept an RMA at that point . Most accept the time as being fair though, I think the Dell case is a bit unfair . Then again who was the Dell rep? I'd have pointed out the faulty parts in question were NOT a quality brand (bet they weren't) and therefore 5 years was a damn good lifespan for it . Although if it was like a Seagate drive, or ASUS board or some such, then maybe they did have a case . Thats why I don't do generic warranties on the whole PC, I specify each part . And why I chased around for a socket 939 board recently, if my brother didn't need it, then there are 2 others I know who could well do . And its either that or change CPU, board and RAM all in one go, which is way more expensive .	pctek (84)
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