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Thread ID: 104716	2009-11-06 02:29:00	Shootings At Fort Hood - Texas, US - Muslim Shooter Is Responsible	SurferJoe46 (51)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
827619	2009-11-06 23:20:00	Actually if this was NZ, a lot more people would have died, since cops don't carry guns... It would have been much much worse.	Cato (6936)
827620	2009-11-07 00:41:00	I would personally ban all Muslims entry to New Zealand, until they can go for ten years with no terrorist attacks. I know all muslims are not terrorists, and that there are different factions etc, but they are the only mainstream violent religion that preaches jihad etc. Why don't the more moderate states eg Gulf States etc do more against them ? They won't like it when the terrorists start attacking their gleaming skyscrapers and tourist destinations !	Digby (677)
827621	2009-11-07 00:59:00	In the US military there are officers as this guy was and then there are LINE-Officers who are combat or a derivative of special combat capacity . Since I was in the Navy - I can really only speak of that nautical qualification . Line officers can issue LEGAL orders and NON-LINE officers cannot - as they are mostly advanced to the rank for reasons of pay rates and authority in their needed field of expertise . Doctors, priests, journalists, attorneys and others are NOT line officers . Line officers are also endowed with license to carry a weapon - but a psychiatric officer would not qualify for that authority . Most line officers carry handguns and very few carry rifles or things like grenade launchers - I don't care what John Wayne did in the movie The Green Berets - as an officer he would relegate the heavy weapons to the grunts and just carry a sidearm himself . Now a nuts-o psychiatric doctor MAY have had small arms training - and that is prolly the case here - but your so stating that he would have found it hard to kill so many and wound many other with handguns is kinda odd - since the room in which he was shooting had limited access as far as exits go - and the people being shot were kinda captive in a small area that should not have been much more than a large anteroom, not an auditorium or playing field where accuracy was much more relevant to killing . I am not familiar with the weapon mentioned - I can only go by what was posted here - but I had heard it was a 5 . 7MM - if that's the truth . The US news media is so anti-gun that they report everything from a cap pistol to an atomic bomb as an "automatic" weapon . At this point I do not trust the media . The real hero here is that woman cop who got four rounds into him and caused him to cease his attack . Now - the "religious" aspect was mentioned since it's obvious that he was swarthilly (did I coin a word there?) complected and with the triple Muslim-sounding names - it became obvious that he was not local talent from some redneck family, nor was he Chinese or a New Zealander - and that the Muslim community came out so instantly and vociferously that he wasn't one of their ilk and mentality - painted him with a very broad paintbrush that only fed the fears and prejudices that most American have for Muslim-sounding and looking persons . Personally I find that mistrust also misguided . I have a very good Egyptian friend who is NOT Muslim and he is constantly defending himself and his family when things like this happen . Unfortunately Americans are not broad minded when it comes to scenarios like this . Mass murder is OK on the battlefield - but not on US soil - is the common delineative factor here and there are veterans' groups and knee-jerk militants who want to now make a purge of every city of illegal aliens and those with turbans and Eastern-sounding surnames . You can bet that the way they want to work things there might be hangings and caged bodies swinging from trees on every aisle and thoroughfare in every hamlet . You've gotta remember that the older generation of Americans had a rough way to go when they lived through the "Great Depression", the Second World War and Korea and now some even were in Vietnam and like my father when the Somali pirates grabbed that US-flagged ship a while back, said: "I want to die now - my government has let me and the world down . There's nothing left but to die . " These people are fed up with the pantywaist-ed agendas of the current administration and there might be some serious repercussions about this in a big way . It is being said that Obama is another one-term president - if he lives long enough to see his successor, that is . The tide has changed and the groundswell is rising . People are angry that the US has fallen to a forth-rate non-world power by bleeding heart liberals and tree-huggers . I just watch, observe and report . .	SurferJoe46 (51)
827622	2009-11-07 02:00:00	5.7mm would be classed "exotic" ammo by anti gun groups. And there is only one pistol capable of firing it. (without converting). More power than a .45, less recoil than a .22. And there a magazines for that pistol (FN 57) that will go up to 30 rounds. (And now there will be a backlash against 5.7s) (Or if it wasn't a pistol but the semi-auto-machine-gun (FN P90), it'd be a 50 round mag) So it does sound more plausible now. In fact, as first I didn't think the guy was arab, just muslim.. Since I remembered a few years ago some "white" soldier who converted to Islam did some stupid (spying or something) things in Afghanistan. Everyone is reporting conflicting things now, so we can't really tell what's what. Give it a few weeks and days till everything is confirmed, then we can judge.	Cato (6936)
827623	2009-11-07 02:02:00	SJ, could you carry a gun onto a military base if you had a Concealed Carry permit? Could you carry a carbine onto a base? (As open carry?)	Cato (6936)
827624	2009-11-08 00:14:00	I would personally ban all Muslims entry to New Zealand, until they can go for ten years with no terrorist attacks. Yes and let's ban all Americans from NZ also in case they drive on the wrong side of the road and kill somebody. :)	decibel (11645)
827625	2009-11-08 00:25:00	I think it's more disturbing that he is a shrink. Heck YES! Gotta wonder what sort of environment it's like there :stare:	TickTech (15391)
827626	2009-11-08 02:11:00	SJ, could you carry a gun onto a military base if you had a Concealed Carry permit? Could you carry a carbine onto a base? (As open carry?) Prolly not as a civilian or even a civilian police officer who has a license to carry a concealed weapon - must turn them in at the guard/gate to the (either) MP or SP or AP there and they in turn take said weapon and lock it into a safe under dual keys. MP = Military Police SP = Shore Patrol AP = Air Police I have seen civilian authorities who were escorted by the MPs or Marines on the Navy Base In Los Angeles (NAVSTALOSALBCH) Awhen they had to take a prisoner from the brig where the Navy held them. At these times I believe that a police officer (civilian) can CCW, but only under color of military authority. Remember that a military base (commonly called a "reservation") is NOT in the US technically! It is a sovereign area set aside for US military. Technically - the US Constitution is waved at the gate and you come under the Universal Code Of Military Justice (UCMJ) and fall prey to the US Judge Advocate General's Office for jurisdiction. Ever see "JAG"?	SurferJoe46 (51)
827627	2009-11-08 03:12:00	You are doomed with military justice. If they cant charge you with a breach of regulations in their law book they will get under the good ol conduct prejudice.	prefect (6291)
827628	2009-11-08 03:27:00	You are doomed with military justice . If they cant charge you with a breach of regulations in their law book they will get under the good ol conduct prejudice . Article 86 - maybe not . Let me research Here it is - Article 133: Punitive Articles of the UCMJ Article 133—Conduct unbecoming an officer and gentleman	SurferJoe46 (51)
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