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Thread ID: 112286	2010-08-30 20:44:00	This site for you Hone Key followers.	Trev (427)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
1133258	2010-08-31 22:07:00	Ok, starting with Speedy: “That maybe true, but what the treaty said, and what the crown said / did were different. How do you or anyone KNOW there are no full blooded Maori now? Did you go around NZ to check?” Yes Speedy what the Treaty said and meant has been a bone of contention in recent times but we must remember it was signed in 1840 and there have been many documents world wide signed in that era that have been the subject of scrutiny as to meaning in recent years. My point is it is now 2010 so the Treaty is largely irrelevant. There are plenty of people of Maori decent that say dump the bl..dy thing, Winston Peters being one. The matter of knowing if there was any full blooded Maoris still alive goes back to a question in Parliament some 15 years ago when Sir Peter Tapsell was a Minister. His response to the question was that according to the New Zealand Register of Births Deaths and Marriages the last full blooded Maori died in 1940 something. Therefore, I guess it is reasonable to assume he was correct. There were no contradictions at the time. Note how many of the Maori Activists have Pakeha surnames. ;) Now John: Would you like to tell me why the Moriori has been completely overlooked these days? I guess they were inconvenient when it came to the argument of who was first here. Until recently the teachings were that the Moriori were of Melanesian decent and the Maori of Polynesian decent. Then there are the findings here: www.celticnz.co.nz I’m not sure about the detail, but why would the Government restrict the information until 2063? There are plenty of other sites that also suggest that human’s existed in New Zealand prior to Maori and which seem to support the premise that they were of Melanesian decent. (Google is your friend.) Marty: I hope the above helps and you’ll find a lot of evidence in the links that the previous site provides. However, the bottom line is that it’s high time we became One Country and the Government stopped making legislation based on Colour, Class, or Creed.	B.M. (505)
1133259	2010-08-31 22:26:00	Exactly. :)	Trev (427)
1133260	2010-08-31 22:40:00	I can't believe how retarded people are about this BS. Maybe one day maori can be like the Israelis and we'll be the Palestinians, fair ain't it? Lets get on with our lives. This is all an endless cycle of BS.	Cato (6936)
1133261	2010-08-31 22:43:00	Segregation, discrimination, obliteration.	Cato (6936)
1133262	2010-08-31 22:50:00	(snip) Now John: Would you like to tell me why the Moriori has been completely overlooked these days? I guess they were inconvenient when it came to the argument of who was first here. Until recently the teachings were that the Moriori were of Melanesian decent and the Maori of Polynesian decent. Then there are the findings here: www.celticnz.co.nz I’m not sure about the detail, but why would the Government restrict the information until 2063? There are plenty of other sites that also suggest that human’s existed in New Zealand prior to Maori and which seem to support the premise that they were of Melanesian decent. (snip) However, the bottom line is that it’s high time we became One Country and the Government stopped making legislation based on Colour, Class, or Creed. Well, I guess we had to get to the conspiracy theories about the Moriori at some stage. Tiresome old chestnut that always gets trotted out, despite the facts. BM, I learnt all the crap you are trotting out in primary school and I guess you did too. First, that information was all written up by Pākehā amateur ethnologists like Percy Smith who took the evidence he was given and re-shaped it to fit his thesis. The world has moved on since you and I were at primary school; the evidence has been re-examined, and other evidence has been collected and analysed, and my grandchildren are getting a more accurate view of the world than you and I were given by our teachers (hey, you probably still believe that Māori got here through accidental drift voyaging, right?). And Moriori are not a separate ethnic group by the way; they are an iwi Māori, like Tuhoe, Te Arawa, Te Atiawa etc. They became a unique culture, different in many ways from other iwi because their culture diverged as a result of isolation. But all of this stuff, including quantum of blood theories, the Moriori myth, the little green men who built those mysterious "rock walls" in the Kaimanawas etc, and whether or not the Chinese and Tamils got here centuries ago is irrelevant to the foreshore and seabed debate. Fact. The British Crown recognised Māori had sovereignty when they got here. See the 1835 Declaration of Independence. Fact. The British Crown was asked by Māori to come into the country officially, to protect them from the British, French, American and Australian scumbags who were stealing their land, and raping their women. Fact. The Crown and hapū signed the Treaty of Waitangi that protected Māori lands, forests and fisheries and treasured things. Fact. The Crown has changed - and it has changed its name. No longer the British Crown, but the New Zealand Crown. But the Crown still exists. Fact. Hapū have changed, and the names of people within them have changed. But they still exist, and the quantum of blood theory does not change that. Fact. The Courts have held that the Crown has not extinguished Māori customary rights to the foreshore and seabed. No-one knows to what extent, if any, hapū can prove that they have maintained their customary rights. Probably few have. Fact. The only way to find this out is by recourse to the High Court (not the Waitangi Tribunal). Labour took away the legal right of hapū to do this. Fact. National is looking at a way of returning those rights of recourse to the Court. Try to hang on to those facts, and try to avoid being diverted down irrelevant pathways. And you may like to do some modern reading to educate yourself about the history of this country.	John H (8)
1133263	2010-08-31 23:15:00	Well I guess we must accommodate Maui as well seeing he fished up the North Island and wasn’t even mentioned in the Treaty. :( But wait, I’ve just remembered, I’m an ancestor of Maui’s so this land is my land and I’ve a few Trespass Orders to write out. :lol:	B.M. (505)
1133264	2010-08-31 23:35:00	Well I guess we must accommodate Maui as well seeing he fished up the North Island and wasn’t even mentioned in the Treaty. :( But wait, I’ve just remembered, I’m an ancestor of Maui’s so this land is my land and I’ve a few Trespass Orders to write out. :lol: We will have to visit John in his Pa,see what he gets up to. Practicing Hakka is my guess.	Cicero (40)
1133265	2010-09-01 00:48:00	Another thing that gets up my nose about all this is that for about 150 years the Treaty and all its ramifications were seen as fine by both Maori and Pakeha, but then a few Maori Academics saw fit to stir up all this s..t. Unfortunately, successive, touchy, feely, dumbas governments have seen fit to take notice of the stirrers. Anyway Cicero you’ll be pleased to know I caught up with this "John" and served an eviction order on him. He didn’t mind as he say’s he’s going to live with the Queen. :thumbs: www.imagef1.net.nz	B.M. (505)
1133266	2010-09-01 01:10:00	Anyway Cicero you’ll be pleased to know I caught up with this "John" and served an eviction order on him. He didn’t mind as he say’s he’s going to live with the Queen. :thumbs: www.imagef1.net.nz With luck we won't hear from him again,what with him teaching her the Hakka,which as far as I can see,is about all they can do. Oh and congrats on you ability to do flags etc,Sweep will be jealous.	Cicero (40)
1133267	2010-09-01 04:00:00	I can't believe how retarded people are about this BS. Maybe one day maori can be like the Israelis and we'll be the Palestinians, fair ain't it? Lets get on with our lives. This is all an endless cycle of BS. Not quite we are the majority and we own most of the guns. Pals other way around minority and no guns. Poor buggers.	prefect (6291)
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