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Thread ID: 118328	2011-05-30 20:55:00	Economics Rant	pctek (84)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
1205713	2011-05-31 04:47:00	Big fan of bringing back the Apprenticeship, personally! So am I. School and tertiary education isn't for everyone it would appear. I did an apprenticeship as a coppersmith but I wouldn't know where to find one these days.	Snorkbox (15764)
1205714	2011-05-31 04:48:00	The Gov't used to do that a while back. Yep, used to be a lot of trade restrictions etc. But personally, I'd rather have the choice :)	inphinity (7274)
1205715	2011-05-31 05:08:00	So am I. School and tertiary education isn't for everyone it would appear. I did an apprenticeship as a coppersmith but I wouldn't know where to find one these days. My brother semi-dropped out at the age of 14 for a variety of reasons, did his apprenticeship in abseiling and waterproofing, he's now earning a very good wage and one of the more qualified people in NZ in that field. He's 22.	Chilling_Silence (9)
1205716	2011-05-31 05:19:00	There are over 9500 jobs on TradeMe Jobs alone right now, 1500 of them in the IT sector . Fact is there's a lot of people who are picky about jobs . Don't want to wake up at 4AM to be work in a bakery because they want to sleep in, so will take hand-outs from the Govt until then . Sigh . Of the 9500 there are a bunch that, I for example, wouldn't get because I have no experience/quals in it . So let's eliminate them . Still quite a few - let's apply for the bakery job . hey, I can actually make bread even . Buy no, I don't have actual job experience doing it, and if I was younger I might get away with it - apply for a trainee role, but not now . I'm too old for trainees roles . Who says? The employers . I've tried it . Pity, I wouldn't mind that actually . So, let's go with stuff I can do and don't need to learn . You know what I get a lot? I don't have enough IT for the IT roles and for the non-IT roles, I apparently have too much IT . Er . Right . Add age, add the fact I had a business myself, not once but twice, never mind how well it did, and that puts them off too . It should be a plus right? Well no, apparently that's a no because I'm not used to a boss . Ok there a few jobs left I could actually get, assuming I win over the other 50 or so applicants, and the 10 or so they interview, but sometimes it comes down to do they like you or not too . Still there are the one or two I've succeeded with . Just as well we don't have to do this every year . So saying 9500 jobs is a bit of a joke . Even you Chill - how many of the medical jobs would you even get an interview for if you applied? Be real, there are not that many jobs for any of us, we have to stick with our career area once we get past being able to convince an employer we're doing our training .	pctek (84)
1205717	2011-05-31 05:24:00	John Key's choice of 1970 is very carefully contrived . There was no DPB in 1970 . It was first introduced in 1974 . Consequently not hard to play the negativity game . Not only was there no DPB, but in 1970 the registered unemployed was so low that it was said that the Department of Labour staff knew the names of every unemployed person from memory . No wonder the number of beneficiaries then was also very low .	Terry Porritt (14)
1205718	2011-05-31 15:03:00	"Cars were shipped to NZ in crates CKD and assembled here for example." Nissan was one of the car assemblers in the 70s and 80s and early 90s until it shut its plant along with all the other companies. Typical assembly man hours per Unit in the Wiri plant were 33 hours - in the Sagamihara plant in Japan it was 11 Hours - the reason in Japan they used Robotics for the Jigs line and metal prep and paint lines - NZs total annual Nissan production equated to a mere 23 hours production at the Sagamihara plant, but it gave gainfull work to round 300 Kiwi workers at the Wiri Assembly Plant, plus many more with the component manufacturers. Nissan Motors Japan preferred to do all the work in Japan, and so made assembly in NZ as costly as possible, by allowing derisory credit for the mandatory deletion list of components, this was so pointed it was blatant, the FOB price of a CKD unit was about 75% of a CBU Car, so the product was always going to be expensive. Nissan was no different to any of the other companies, and NZ assembled cars were expensive, artificially so, as a matter of Policy by the international car companies, but the NZ Motor Industry created a lot of jobs and this was socially beneficial, the workers had the benefit of employment and the improved self esteem that goes with being gainfully employed. With the closure of the car plants, TV assembly plants, and all the other manufacturing operations in NZ, the International parent companies made more bottom line and the NZ taxpayer picked up the social cost, 100s of welfare beneficiaries were created, along with a whole new raft of social problems that go with unemployment. Sir Ron Brierley through his companies probably put more Kiwis out of work than any other business man, and he got a bloody knighthood for it, and the surprising thing was that all the efficiencies of economies of scale actually meant more bottom line for the businessmen, not cheaper goods for the NZ consumer, certainly not in the short term. Did this exporting of 10s of thousands of Kiwi jobs make New Zealand a better place to live, personally I don't think so, it exacerbated racial tensions in the country because the victims of this rationalisation of NZs manufacturing industries, particularly in Auckland, were Maori and Pacific Islanders who in many cases made up a significant portion of the NZ workers thrown out of work. Similarly the loss of the clothing and footwear industries to Asia made unemployment victims of large numbers of women. If people don't have jobs or lose their jobs there are 3 outcomes, none are good: The size of the taxpayer base is reduced and there are fewer people contibuting to the economy. The productive sector shrinks. The cost of social welfare increases, due to increased unemployment. The associated social problems of crime, poverty and social alienation are exacerbated. The country becomes a less pleasant place to live. (The relationship between crime and unemployment is that for every 1% that unemployment increases crime increases by 4%) The less one makes in country for home consumption, the more that has to be imported, and the more New Zealand needs to export to pay for the imports. Unhappily there is protectionism in most markets for New Zealand's primary produce, with consequential problems in achieving the export revenue necessary to pay for our elevated demand for imported manufactured goods - a typical catch 22 scenario, that has not boded well for NZ for over 20 years.	KenESmith (6287)
1205719	2011-05-31 15:10:00	At least this looks like a small step in the right direction I hope. home.nzcity.co.nz	Snorkbox (15764)
1205720	2011-05-31 15:35:00	, to an even greater degree than they already do? Please enlighten me as to what controls there are now.:(	mikebartnz (21)
1205721	2011-05-31 15:54:00	"Cars were shipped to NZ in crates CKD and assembled here for example." If you and PCtek want to create a new party I will support you.	mikebartnz (21)
1205722	2011-05-31 19:37:00	If you and PCtek want to create a new party I will support you. Well I'll join too so we only need another 496 people to become paid up members then. Wait, as Ken resides in Aussie I'm not sure he would be eligible so maybe another 497 then. It's very confusing to me, at the moment, to work out what the National Party actually wants. Don Brash wants us to save but without money going into the economy we don't get growth. The Gov't have announced that my 5 year old TV which receives analogue TV will have to be upgraded to receive the likes of Freeview which will REQUIRE me to at least purchase a set top box and probably a new aerial or dish as well.	Snorkbox (15764)
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