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Thread ID: 120054	2011-08-23 08:41:00	Is this what university level english classes are like?	Question (15792)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
1225347	2011-08-23 14:43:00	>Arguing about grammar on an internet forum I seriously hope you don't do this.	Question (15792)
1225348	2011-08-23 14:46:00	I've read some abstracts and articles and parts of theses where people make typos everywhere. Hell, one of my networking papers is taught by a guy from the school of engineering. Sure he's got a doctorate in something but he doesn't know the subject that he teaches very well. Same goes for my database lecturers. Neither speak very good english, the lab helper can barely speak at all, and we're expected to pay these people 800 dollars a paper? Perhaps this is part of why so many students don't pay their loans back. Because it's a whole lot of money for a whole lot of nothing.	8ftmetalhaed (14526)
1225349	2011-08-23 15:00:00	University English is no longer what it was. To quote a former colleague Professor Terry Sturm, we get students hoping to enroll for Stage 1 English who can't write a sentence without a grammatical error, let alone having read one significant work of English Literature. Simply, the study of English as it used to be, and still should be is no longer taught in most NZ secondary schools. Mastery of one's mother tongue should be the mark of an educated person, irrespective of what direction their higher education takes. Far too many young people are not exposed, let alone come to appreciate the rich heritage that is English Literature. Elementary spelling and grammatical errors should be marked down in all university exam papers, because a University Degree should give the recipient the accolade of being an educated person. Well, the fact that a english degree is largely useless doesnt help does it? Try enrolling in a company with an english degree, tell the HR person all about how good you are at analysing english texts and literature, and you will probably get laughed out of the interview room, unless you are applying to be a english teacher or something similar. If you look on the internet theres no shortage of "I took an arts degree and now nobody wants to hire me except for high school level positions!" stories. There's certaintly a reason why the requirements to get into a english course is so much lower than, say, computer science, engineering, medicine...even business. There's also a reason why people generally regard arts students as one of three categories : -Wants to be a teacher -Couldn't get into any other courses(failed highschool really badly) but parents wanted them to go the university anyway and they can't afford to go overseas -Wants a degree cert and thinks this is the easiest way to get it, probably parties a lot At the end of the day, sitting around a table for an hour or two and talking about "What was the author trying to say" achieves nothing more than people sitting around the table talking about last weekend's ball game. It's a perfectly valid conversation topic of course, but there's no work being done here. And i was under the assumption that all universities, regardless of faculty, mark students down for grammar/spelling mistakes. Mine certaintly does.	Question (15792)
1225350	2011-08-23 16:59:00	Yeah - and they teach youse guys to sprinkle an extra 'u' in perfectly good words WITHOUT the 'u' where it shouldn't be . Nouw, I knouw youse guuys likue tuo spuell things that-a-way - sou I guuess there's nou way tuo correct youuse guuys by nouw anyway . Sidebar: Is your concept of English solely in things-literate or is there grammar, spelling and sentence structure involved in your English studies? I would also imagine that modern students have no knowledge of the writer: Chaucer . . . . . . . . . . . and that Shakespeare was a guild, not an individual writer .	SurferJoe46 (51)
1225351	2011-08-23 23:19:00	I learned most from my teachers who gave me the answers	Gobe1 (6290)
1225352	2011-08-24 00:11:00	Yeah - and they teach youse guys to sprinkle an extra 'u' in perfectly good words WITHOUT the 'u' where it shouldn't be . Nouw, I knouw youse guuys likue tuo spuell things that-a-way - sou I guuess there's nou way tuo correct youuse guuys by nouw anyway . Sidebar: Is your concept of English solely in things-literate or is there grammar, spelling and sentence structure involved in your English studies? I would also imagine that modern students have no knowledge of the writer: Chaucer . . . . . . . . . . . and that Shakespeare was a guild, not an individual writer . The course doesn't teach you grammar, spelling, etc at all . It's been nothing but "analysing" literature .	Question (15792)
1225353	2011-08-24 03:38:00	>Arguing about grammar on an internet forum I seriously hope you don't do this. Well one should use the Queens' English whenever possible and technically, one should always type with one's right pinky finger extended upward, toward the heavens, in much the same way as one would participate in drinking a cup of Earl Grey with royalty. Ow's that Gov'ner ?? .... :D	SP8's (9836)
1225354	2011-08-24 04:04:00	I never liked English classes in school, despite doing quite well in it. I think study of the language and grammar, punctuation and such is useful but the literature side of things is an entirely different subject in my opinion. You could theoretically study English by reading the dictionary and nothing else. I got in trouble for doing a book review of a western novel, not real literature apparently. I don't approve of such intellectual eliteism myself and suspect a best selling author of "pulp fiction" knows more than your average english teacher about writing a book. I quickly discovered that high school english was about telling the teacher what they wanted to hear in the format they told you to express it in, and not actually much to do with your own opinion or taste in literature. Sorry,this subject seems to have sent me off on a tangental rant...	dugimodo (138)
1225355	2011-08-24 04:45:00	I learned most from my teachers who gave me the answers So how did that help you to learn to think then? Knowledge without learning is useless, and if that is the best response you can give to serious educational issues then clearly they did you no favours at all. Older people may not be whiz kids on video games, or know how to draw blood out of a mobile phone, but they sure know the value of learning, and that teaching and learning are not just a matter of giving the answers. While smarter in many ways, more recent generations are hopelessly incompetent at the art of life and lack the basic survival skills to be self supporting in an ever more complex world. The first thing the disposable society disposed of was common sense and the 'oh no it's broken' or 'it's six months out of date' generation (it's like, just sooo yesterday) can't get out of their own way. Wingeing about an english lesson instead of rising to the challenge and actually making something of it is not going to do much for future job prospects. I am reminded of my grammar school days as a junior, when a Prefect caught me running in a corridor (verboten!) and I was ordered to deliver a one page essay on discipline. I found it a very interesting assignment and on due date I delivered a 3 page essay on the topic. The Prefect actually read it, then sought me out and asked if he could keep it as he found it very interesting. I remember feeling rather flattered and pleased that he had asked. This is the 'I want everything on a plate' generation, but many can't be bothered putting in the effort to actually earn their credits, be they financial or academic. My kids were brought up with a foot in each camp, they are thoroughly modern (which makes their parents boring old farts) but know how to fend for themselves, can cook and bake to a very high standard, worked hard at school and sport, sucessfully negotiated their way through their university degrees and now our daughter is doing her Masters and our son is doing Honours. There was hard work and stress along the way, but at the end of it all they actually earned their right to graduate. Our son quickly found out that to get a Degree is easy, but Honours is hard work and the first thing he had to learn was how to write academic english (that funny way of writing where grammar, punctuation, and occasional use of words with more than six letters is considered rather important.) We are fortunate to live in a society where education is readily available to all who wish to take advantage of it, but parents do not always do what they should to help their kids. Mrs T works at an early childhood centre, and they have children who can read, write and count at 4 years old and are ready for school, then they get kids brought in six months before they are due to start school who variously can't toilet themselves, feed themselves, change their clothes, read, write or count. Kids who don't know what a vegetable is and have only ever eaten chips, chippies, KFC or McDonalds and drunk coke. There are 3 year olds who have had teeth removed because they were rotten to the core, and four year olds with scarcely any teeth left at all. And these are the kids of parents who can afford day care and complain that the Centre is closed on public holidays, while some have even asked if they will be open Christmas day! Modern youth should be grateful for the opportunities they all have in front of them and make the most of each and every one. Cheers Billy	Billy T (70)
1225356	2011-08-24 04:49:00	Here! Here! Good on ya!	SurferJoe46 (51)
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