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Thread ID: 123451	2012-02-25 22:23:00	So it’s confirmed!	B.M. (505)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
1261519	2012-02-28 21:17:00	So two wrongs make a right in your book. I thought so. Clearly the accident shouldn’t have happened in the first place, but that doesn’t excuse a botched rescue effort. Or more accurately No rescue effort. The absurdity of your position is hard to comprehend, it doesn't make any sense and your own arguments work against it. The first wrong was to send the miners into a situation that could and did kill them. The second wrong would have been to send a rescue team into the same situation, but with 100% evidence of the worst case scenario and likely outcome. Two wrongs don't make a right, But that is exactly what you wanted to see happen. And for that you are a fool.	Metla (12)
1261520	2012-02-28 21:55:00	The absurdity of your position is hard to comprehend, it doesn't make any sense and your own arguments work against it. The first wrong was to send the miners into a situation that could and did kill them. The second wrong would have been to send a rescue team into the same situation, but with 100% evidence of the worst case scenario and likely outcome. Two wrongs don't make a right, But that is exactly what you wanted to see happen. And for that you are a fool. What absolute rubbish. There is not one shred of evidence to suggest that the Rescue Team would have been hurt in any way let alone killed. It’s all in your mind. It has been said by the experts on numerous occasions that they do not believe the structural integrity of the Mine has been compromised by either explosion. I understand about the first 2000m is through rock before you get to the coal. It’s this area where I feel they may have found survivors. Possibly a couple of hundred metres behind the two that made it out. If there were any, they were possibly unhurt and died from asphyxiation. That is why a rescue mission had to be mounted immediately. Probably the worst possible scenario was the Rescue Team walked in, found nobody, couldn’t get to where they wanted to go and walked back out again. At least they would have tried. I’m afraid one of the problems we have in this country is much of it is now being run by spineless dicks who worship an OSH Manual. :groan:	B.M. (505)
1261521	2012-02-28 22:11:00	Yep, The problem is too much safety, It sucks how it keeps people alive. Send em in to die. That worked awesome, send some more into die. Yaaaaay	Metla (12)
1261522	2012-02-28 23:26:00	What absolute rubbish. There is not one shred of evidence to suggest that the Rescue Team would have been hurt in any way let alone killed. It’s all in your mind. It has been said by the experts on numerous occasions that they do not believe the structural integrity of the Mine has been compromised by either explosion. I understand about the first 2000m is through rock before you get to the coal. It’s this area where I feel they may have found survivors. Possibly a couple of hundred metres behind the two that made it out. If there were any, they were possibly unhurt and died from asphyxiation. That is why a rescue mission had to be mounted immediately. Probably the worst possible scenario was the Rescue Team walked in, found nobody, couldn’t get to where they wanted to go and walked back out again. At least they would have tried. I’m afraid one of the problems we have in this country is much of it is now being run by spineless dicks who worship an OSH Manual. :groan: so they posibly died from asphixiation, or noxious gases... and not injuries.................and yet you still wanted to send somebody else in and have them possibly end up in the same prediciment....... dead. any risk to others is too greater risk........... instead of 29 dead you could have had another 10 or 20 dead, and still no bodies.	beetle (243)
1261523	2012-02-28 23:40:00	Yep, The problem is too much safety, It sucks how it keeps people alive. Send em in to die. That worked awesome, send some more into die. Yaaaaay That's good, you have a little rave, it might make you feel better. :) By the way, how long does it take you to establish it’s safe to get out of bed in the morning, or do you err on the side of caution and stay there? :D	B.M. (505)
1261524	2012-02-28 23:57:00	so they posibly died from asphixiation, or noxious gases... and not injuries.................and yet you still wanted to send somebody else in and have them possibly end up in the same prediciment....... dead. any risk to others is too greater risk........... instead of 29 dead you could have had another 10 or 20 dead, and still no bodies. Jeeeez Beatle, the Rescue Team has breathing apparatus and is properly equipped for the job they’re trained for. Nobody was making them go in, quite the reverse, they wanted to go and weren't allowed and that’s the problem. And, a Rescue Teams first priority is to rescue the living, not recover the dead. Imagine if you will, you are stuck in your car after an accident and it is on fire. Metla turns up and you hear him announce get back, get back, the OSH Manual says you might get burnt trying to get her out, or the car may explode. I’d bet you’d have a different point of view then. :lol:	B.M. (505)
1261525	2012-02-29 01:27:00	BM - you are a ****** - period!	Zippity (58)
1261526	2012-02-29 01:40:00	I had intended to stay out of this thread, but I have to admit I'm really curious about this one particular point: B.M. - From your perspective, can you think of any way in which a human could have survived the second explosion in the mine, while simultaneously looking for survivors / bodies? Unless you can answer that, your position has no validity whatsoever, as there is clear evidence of overwhelming risk backed up by an event that you agree occurred (i.e. the second explosion). If you were in charge of the rescue operation, would you have sent rescuers into a situation where there was a strong likelihood that the second explosion would kill them?	Erayd (23)
1261527	2012-02-29 02:02:00	And, a Rescue Teams first priority is to rescue the living, not recover the dead. Earlier in this thread I ask about who had experience in rescue... Anyone who has done rescue training will tell you that a Rescue Teams first priority is the safety of the team itself. A dead rescuer is no good to anyone. and I speak from my 10 years of rescue experience, 3 years as team leader. I have no experience with coal mine rescue, but in a case like this there are many factors many of which are not made public. you can't know who was thinking what just by reading a new paper. unless you are there on the day, its very hard to know all the facts. this thread is getting a bit pointless, and may even be seen as offensive to the people who did their best on the day.	robsonde (120)
1261528	2012-02-29 02:29:00	Well said Rob. I hope posters to this to this thread (if any now) will give similar consideration to what they say.	Richard (739)
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