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Thread ID: 125186	2012-06-12 03:48:00	The Great American Con	Roscoe (6288)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
1281200	2012-06-12 03:48:00	Why is it that the Yanks place their hand over their left tit when they hear or sing their national anthem? It seems that they like to put their hand over their heart. Could it be that they think that's where their heart is? Why? Are the Yanks different from everyone else? It seems that they might be.:waughh: I don't know about you, but my heart is in the centre of my chest - albiet ever so slightly to the left, but in the centre nevertheless. And I'm quite certain that if you were to speak to any member of the medical profession they would confirm that the heart is in the centre and not on the left as the Yanks seem to think. So who is the instigator of the Great American Con? He certainly was not a medical man. The unfortunate thing about this is that the Yanks are very influential and I see people in this country - children as well as adults - copying the Yanks. Oh dear. How sad. Have no part of the Great American Con. If you must place your hand over your heart when you sing the NZ national anthem, then show the world that Kiwis are not that stupid and place your hand over the centre of your chest. That's where my heart resides. How about you?	Roscoe (6288)
1281201	2012-06-12 04:50:00	If only Hitler didn't ruin the Bellamy Salute (en.wikipedia.org)	bob_doe_nz (92)
1281202	2012-06-12 04:56:00	Yup, the heart is in the center of your chest - maybe the yanks think their lift tit os more important than their heart :D	Nick G (16709)
1281203	2012-06-12 09:04:00	They put their hand where they think their heart is. Not their fault that they are poorly educated.	nerd89 (14761)
1281204	2012-06-12 09:10:00	meh According to the United States Flag Code, the Pledge of Allegiance reads:[2] I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. According to the Flag Code, the Pledge "should be rendered by standing at attention facing the flag with the right hand over the heart. Members of the Armed Forces and veterans who are present and not in uniform may render the military salute. Persons in uniform should remain silent, face the flag, and render the military salute".[2] If there is any great delusion in that, its the reference to god, Not the specific location of their heart.	Metla (12)
1281205	2012-06-12 13:47:00	The 'under God' reference was only put there since 54. It had nothing to do with religion. Rather it was to distinguish the US from the Soviets.	bob_doe_nz (92)
1281206	2012-06-12 15:11:00	The 'under God' reference was only put there since 54 . It had nothing to do with religion . Rather it was to distinguish the US from the Soviets . There's a slight truth to that, but there were religionists that actually wanted the inclusion to be there, long before The USSR was seen as a godless society . Actually the 'Under God' inclusion to 'The Pledge' was representative of the ardor for the Gettysburg Address ( . wikipedia . org/wiki/Gettysburg_Address" target="_blank">en . wikipedia . org), originally spoken by (the then) President Lincoln at the end of the hostilities in The US Civil War . Later, a (for profit) magazine published and directed toward schoolhouses and lower units of education, wanted to pump it's income and a Baptist minister decided a good way was to make it necessary for every school house to own, display and pledge allegiance to an American flag which the magazine would also provide 'at cost' . from the WIKI::: . . . . . The Pledge of Allegiance was written in 1892 by Francis Bellamy (1855–1931), who was a Baptist minister, a Christian socialist, and the cousin of socialist utopian novelist Edward Bellamy (1850–1898) . The original "Pledge of Allegiance" was published in the September 8 issue of the popular children's magazine The Youth's Companion as part of the National Public-School Celebration of Columbus Day, a celebration of the 400th anniversary of Christopher Columbus's arrival in the Americas . The event was conceived and promoted by James B . Upham, a marketer for the magazine, as a campaign to instill the idea of American nationalism by selling flags to public schools and magazines to students The Pledge was supposed to be quick and to the point . Bellamy designed it to be recited in 15 seconds . As a socialist, he had initially also considered using the words equality and fraternity but decided against it - knowing that the state superintendents of education on his committee were against equality for women and African Americans . Francis Bellamy and Upham had lined up the National Education Association to support the "Youth's Companion" as a sponsor of the Columbus Day observance along with the use of the American flag . By June 29, 1892, Bellamy and Upham had arranged for Congress and President Benjamin Harrison to announce a proclamation making the public school flag ceremony the center of the Columbus Day celebrations (this was issued as Presidential Proclamation 335) . Subsequently, the Pledge was first used in public schools on October 12, 1892, during Columbus Day observances organized to coincide with the opening of the World's Columbian Exposition in Chicago, Illinois . (ibid): . . . . "Of course, the nub of the program was to be the raising of the (purchased) flag, with a salute to the flag recited by the pupils in unison . " He found "There was not a satisfactory enough form for this salute . The original (Balch) salute which ran 'I give my heart and my hand to my country, one country, one language, one flag . ' seemed too juvenile and lacking in dignity . " After working on the idea with Upham, Bellamy concluded "It was my thought that a vow of loyalty or allegiance to the flag should be the dominant idea . I especially stressed the word 'allegiance . ' . . . The debate was on, and The Pledge was put to modification many times - all unsuccessful for many years and for many causes . (again: The WIKI) . . . . . Prior to February 1954, no endeavor to get the Pledge officially amended succeeded . The final successful push came from George MacPherson Docherty . Some American presidents honored Lincoln's birthday by attending services at the church Lincoln attended, New York Avenue Presbyterian Church by sitting in Lincoln's pew on the Sunday nearest February 12 . On February 7, 1954, with President Eisenhower sitting in Lincoln's pew, the church's pastor, George MacPherson Docherty, delivered a sermon based on the Gettysburg Address titled "A New Birth of Freedom . " He argued that the nation's might lay not in arms but its spirit and higher purpose . He noted that the Pledge's sentiments could be those of any nation, that "there was something missing in the pledge, and that which was missing was the characteristic and definitive factor in the American way of life . " He cited Lincoln's words "under God" as defining words that set the United States apart from other nations . President Eisenhower had been baptized a Presbyterian very recently, just a year before . He responded enthusiastically to Docherty in a conversation following the service . Eisenhower acted on his suggestion the next day and on February 8, 1954, Rep . Charles Oakman (R-Mich . ), introduced a bill to that effect . Congress passed the necessary legislation and Eisenhower signed the bill into law on Flag Day, June 14, 1954 . Eisenhower stated: "In this way we are reaffirming the transcendence of religious faith in America's heritage and future; in this way we shall constantly strengthen those spiritual weapons which forever will be our country's most powerful resource, in peace or in war . " The phrase "under God" was incorporated into the Pledge of Allegiance June 14, 1954, by a Joint Resolution of Congress amending §7 of the Flag Code enacted in 1942 . So it was religionists and christendom that pressed for the inclusion . It all fits . NOTE: For ease of reading, I broke the long mono-paragraphs into smaller sentences . An interesting sidebar, of which I had no idea had happened::: An early version of the salute, adopted in 1892, was known as the Bellamy salute . It started with the hand outstretched toward the flag, palm down, and ended with the palm up . Because of the similarity between the Bellamy salute and the Nazi salute, developed later, United States Congress instituted the hand-over-the-heart gesture as the salute to be rendered by civilians during the Pledge of Allegiance and the national anthem in the United States, instead of the Bellamy salute . Removal of the Bellamy salute occurred on December 22, 1942, when Congress amended the Flag Code language first passed into law on June 22, 1942	SurferJoe46 (51)
1281207	2012-06-12 22:20:00	So what happens if you dont pledge allegiance to the American flag? Do you get booted out of the country or something?	Iantech (16386)
1281208	2012-06-12 22:27:00	Nah you get a personal escort to Gitmo and get to spend time picking up the soap in the showers	gary67 (56)
1281209	2012-06-12 22:34:00	Maybe originally they held their hands on their actual heart location in the centre of their chest. Try it, there is tension in the shoulder and not as natural as having the shoulder drop and the hand ends up on the left side.	sam m (517)
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