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Thread ID: 22205	2002-07-14 10:16:00	off topic- what did you think of ........	tweak'e (174)	Press F1

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
62430	2002-07-14 22:53:00	Yeah well. A standard Duspol draws 67 mA at 230 volts so it will easily trip an RCD but the trip threshold could be very high and go undetected. The fancy ones (with phase rotation and LCD displays) draw 50 mA at 750 volts so will fall short of the trip current needed for 230 volts. Bugger. Duspols can't do everything after all. Cheers Billy 8-{)	Billy T (70)
62431	2002-07-14 23:16:00	Four firms selected at random? from PN is quite a large sample really, it would be interesting to know how many domestic electrical contractors there are in the town. No of course the blue coat man doesnt pretend to be an expert on every subject, it is a TV show, he obviously has expert advice to tell him what to say.	Terry Porritt (14)
62432	2002-07-14 23:28:00	I feel it's a bit of a fuzzy sample actually. I think what I was really trying to get at is the fact that there are good electricians out there, but when the industry gets flack like that, it's like everyone's the bad guy. It would be the same with any industry Target reviews. I know the blue coat man isn't an expert and that both of them are reading from cue cards. It would be interesting to know who their "experts" are thought perhaps.	codegirl (1038)
62433	2002-07-15 00:04:00	billy its properly just me looseing something in the translation ;-) will have to find out exact story next time i see him. i have to agre with the rest of what u said. i know a lot of good sparkies but i've also had one of my customers houses burn down due to poor workmanship.	tweak'e (174)
62434	2002-07-15 01:38:00	Yeah Codegirl, their "expert" makes me cringe sometimes too, but I do know the program is usually backed up by Industry acceptable experts. I hate to say it but the problems in the electrical industry are probably more widespread that we would like to think. I see shonky and unsafe work everywhere I go. I was in an apartment building recently where every floor has a fairly big (walk-in) switchboard enclosure that tenants are inclined to use for storage. There are a lot of families in the building and plenty of kids. The main board was not closed and a recent electrician had pulled a phase fuse to isolate an apartment during renovations. It was barely 500 mm off the floor and wide open for any inquisitive kid to poke fingers into to touch the shiny brass contacts. :O Made me shudder I can tell you. I removed the fuse cartridge (30 seconds work) and replaced the fuseholder, but why didn't the electrician do that, and why didn't he (or she) bother to close the SB door. The enclosure can't be locked for safety reasons so it was essential that the switchboards be safe. How many contractors refer to a certificate of compliance (CoC) as a code of compliance? Happened yet again last night and shows that they have never used one. Why I don't know because although the buy price is regulated, the sell price isn't and they can be charged as an obligatory extra. Some electricians I know seized on CoCs as a profit opportunity and make a tidy sum every year from meeting their obligations. To be truthful, I think that if Target did the same random checks anywhere in Godzone they would get pretty much the same outcomes. Cheers Billy 8-{( :(	Billy T (70)
62435	2002-07-15 01:50:00	Billy T - I agree. My boyfriend has told me a few jaw-dropping horror stories which he has had to re-do, one even in his just moved into home. The previous owner drilled a hole in the outer wall of the house incorrectly to do an outside light and it now leaks everytime it rains - the water runs through the hole down the wall into the light switch. I'm not sure whether this was a DIY job, or done by a sparky, but it's pretty dodgy! It's just a shame that of the four they picked to review, they all did badly.	codegirl (1038)
62436	2002-07-15 01:52:00	>phase fuse.... shiny brass contacts OUCH! touching that would be hair toasting to say the least.	tweak'e (174)
62437	2002-07-15 01:56:00	The big problem in this country is that for ever and a day, the electricians have maintained exclusive job protection, prevented electrical education, prevented mature people from entering the trade, and other restrictive practices, using safety as the reason. It's then a bit rich to see the shoddy behaviour of cowboys in the trade. There shouldnt be any cowboys if the industry maintained its standards properly. As in another posting, I come back to the situation at least as it was 25 years ago in the UK when I left, which didnt have any of these restrictive practices, and people were not dying from electrocution left right or centre. Having worked for firms like Joseph Lucas, English Electric, I was quite competent to design, build and sell and install, machine tool control and hydraulic systems, I didnt need a 'ticket'. We just ensured our work conformed to the appropriate standards, either BS, German, or Italian, or sometimes company standards such as British Motor Corporation or SKF depending on where we were selling. For the purposes of QA traceability it was neccessary to obtain independent certification of conformance to those standards from time to time. Do any of these firms employing the cowboys we saw last night ever carry out a quality audit of their work? It would seem not.	Terry Porritt (14)
62438	2002-07-15 02:02:00	>It's just a shame that of the four they picked to review, they all did badly. is it? its only a tiny sample but if the industry was up to scratch you would have thought at least two-three would have done it right. but on the catch side if they did the job properly it would have cost more and more often than not the customer would have got someone esle to do it cheaper. catch 22 get all the gear do every job to the letter of the law and you risk priceing your self out of the market. (side note- osh tried to make changes to one of the types of work i do and they reliased if they put the changes through there would be no industry as no one would pay double the price due to the increase in costs.)	tweak'e (174)
62439	2002-07-15 02:08:00	>Do any of these firms employing the cowboys we saw last night ever carry out a quality audit of their work? also as i have had myself alot of firms contract out and hide behind contracts. oops sorry the mickymouse did that badly so we will find some one esle.......meet mickeymouse no2. pay peanuts get monkeys. not sure about electrical regs but i seen a few industrys gone that way.	tweak'e (174)
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