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Thread ID: 24927	2002-09-22 00:49:00	What is it going to take?	Kame (312)	Press F1

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
81854	2002-09-22 00:49:00	I am doing this because of a friend who brought it up and since I know how hard it must be for everyone who is trying to land a computer job and only to be turned down because you're "inexperienced" (quoted because I think they mean experience from working in some type of business than helping friends and family) . It's really hard for people nowadays to enter the IT industry if no one is willing to give you the experience . I know that experience is important but I find that youth of today are sometimes more computer savvy than most of us guys and giving them a chance to at least succeed . I've been brought up on computers since the age of 4 . It was hard to pull me away from one . I wasn't finding out the technical side of things though, only the operating and software side . It was then at age 10 that I decided to tinker inside the box of a computer only to destroy the power supply thanks to switching the red switch from 240V to 110V (nice blue spark and smell) . You learn from all your mistakes and a few years after that I was fixing all sorts of problems for friends and family . If there was computer problems they'd call on me first . Even then I didn't have much experience in fixing computers but 99 . 9% I correctly fixed the problem . May have been quicker if I had known more about the problems but that only came later . At 16 I wanted to work officially with computers as a technician so I did computer training to get there as well as schooling (left at 17 after six form cert) . At 18 I did everything from making impressive CV's to applying to every job opportunity for computer technicians only to be turned down from lack of experience . The only thing left to do was to work for myself since no one else would hire me . Without money to be professional with my work I thought that starting in the IT industry as a first job just couldn't happen right now . I still did the odd job computer work for a little bit of money but I wanted to be professional with what I do by having proper environment and equipment . So at my age now 19 . . . I went back to studying . I am unemployed now, I try to get as much computer work as I can do just to earn a living yet I can't say that this work is experience but I can still get impressive reference from the people I have worked with . Many from small businesses that I've gotten from family connections and friends . If this counted to the employers as experience they may have considered me . My friend a year older than me and a bright spark went through similar situations . He just couldn't believe it . I can't believe it . He's now working at Sky City (had to wait till he reached 20 to work there) I think there are many more people out there in this situation and the only thing I think that is available for anyone to do is to work for themselves . Easy if you've got the money but some of us just can't do that and easier if you've got friends in the industry who can land you a job . I've considered other jobs away from the IT industry . My parents reckon it's a wasted talent for me (by the way I don't stay with my parents, I live with my bro paying board . . . had to say that) but I am now just wanting to get money so I can establish a technical role for myself . I've started taking interest in the hospitality industry and I hope it's easier to get a job in this industry than IT . I don't want to have the same problems but I guess that's just life if it is the same . I just had to say this . . . it's just to let off my steam from wasting a year trying and then giving up . I don't usually give up but sometimes you just have to realise that you can't always get what you want . I also know helpdesk/callcentre is where most people start from in the IT industry but I am hopeless offering advice over the phone even if I know how to fix the problem . I try to explain things clearly but I can sometimes jargonise my words and leave them looking lost . At least in person I can see that look and explain it even thorough since most people don't ask when they don't know what I am talking about . I notice sometimes my advice isn't put clearly but that's due to how much time I have to spare (this is taking a while) . . . I think that's enough ranting . . . I just wanted to write something long here since I haven't been visiting that often . If you reach this line congratulations and sorry for grammatical and punctiation errors, writing isn't my strongest point . Cheers KK	Kame (312)
81855	2002-09-22 00:54:00	Hey buddy - if you live in the Auckland area, and want a good lead for a job, drop me an email to f1 at mis dot co dot nz.	Greg S (201)
81856	2002-09-22 01:51:00	A lot of jobs are made available by who you know and not what you know, which is a shame because it leads to a lot of wasted talent as you say . Regards Sam H	Sam H (525)
81857	2002-09-22 02:32:00	Really, the country has never recovered from the "reforms" of 1984 onwards . Much of manufacturing was virtually destroyed, apprenticeships disappeared, and science career structures were ruined by that little Upton twirp . Reforms were needed, but much of the destruction was driven by ideology, regardless of the resulting problems . It's easy to knock structures down, but the politicos didnt have the nous to be able to have viable alternatives, for example, to removing import restrictions . (Whats those ? I hear you younger folk say) . Good people were thrown out of work, I know of a chief metallurgist who eventually became a real estate agent, and others similiarly had their skills wasted . We are now paying the price of a lack of a skilled workforce, and current ideology is to promote immigration as a substitute for in-house training . Bolger started that when he proclaimed us to be part of Asia, and changed the rules to allow people to buy their way into the country . Having said all that, 19 is a bit young Kame, to expect to have sound work experience, I was only just starting out on a 5 year "student apprenticeship" at that age, then one used to reckon on another 2 years after graduating before one became a useful member of the organisation one worked for . I was one of the lucky generation, my firm paid for all my education, and provided probably one of the best apprenticeships in the UK at that time, with a degree at the end of it . Continuing education is important, but the cost now to the individual is horrendous, where is it all going to end? Keep plugging away, dont give up . :)	Terry Porritt (14)
81858	2002-09-22 02:53:00	I know, I've got good reference but their industry is industrial and engineering thanks to my stepdad's line of work . I use to know guys in the IT Industry but they went overseas seeking better opportunities . I have the opportunity to work in Australia but I have so much here (not assets but friends and family) that I don't want to leave it all . If things still don't go well . . . I may have to continue giving up . I guess sacrifices have to be made .	Kame (312)
81859	2002-09-22 06:09:00	Personally, I'm just milling around waiting for so many people to bugger off overseas that NZ becomes a ghost town. Only then might I find a job with what's left... I know you feel Kame, I'm in the same situ , only 10 years later and I'm deaf... SiK	SoniKalien (792)
81860	2002-09-22 09:04:00	I really hope that I don't end up in a similar situation. But I have seen it happen a lot of times before. Same with different areas as well. I know of someone that did a BCom and is now working at the Heritage (waiter). I hope you have some luck with finding some work or some investors. Maybe you could work for free (to get experience) somewhere. THey may then find out that you are really good and start paying you. If not you'll get a good reference anyway.	-=JM=- (16)
81861	2002-09-22 10:49:00	I, too, know ho you feel Kame, I'm also in a similar situation , only about 40 years later and I'm supposed to have retired by now. Retire? That's a laugh. Who can retire on no assets and an overdraft and credit cards? I work at a service station and it's not paying my way. Talk about wasted talents......... Maybe we should all get together on this chatline and pool our assets and start up a new ISP or something? For me, trying to get back to my career of survey draughting is no joke. I do AutoCad, Microstation and all their variants. And I'm good at English too. I blame Roger Douglas and his henchman, Richard Prebble. I notice when you ring up these helpdesks at ISP headquarters that all they do is talk to you with a computer in front of them. That's not so hard, eh? The advice they gave me was useless anyway because I used my own sense in the end and just restored my system files. That got me reconnected! Just one thing before I disappear back into cyberspace - I do think that it would be important to brush up on your English skills. Education of late has been poor from the authorities. I have heard them say that it doesn't matter if you can't spell because of spellcheckers these days. They're wrong. It does matter. I have a son like that - brilliantly self taught into using a MAC when he had never seen one before. It wasn't long before he was emailing me his website - but he is still a postman! His grammar is appalling. Perhaps if he wore a suit and tie and did grammar? Best of luck with your job search, Kame. I hope you accumulate enough to buy out all those doubters that wouldn't take you on. BTW - did you reply to F1? (the first post after yours?) Signed, eef2 (I care)	eef2 (1904)
81862	2002-09-22 10:57:00	It's nice to see you on the forum again Kame, even if it is only to let off steam . :-) I have to say that I thought you were a lot older than just 19 - to me you are still a kid! Don't take that as an offence though . To offer you some encouragement I'd like to say "don't give up" . At 19 you are only just beginning in the world really, so even if you have to start off in a temporary job in a totally different field to what you want to do, just do it for now to earn a living and save some money . Meanwhile, keep plugging away at the IT side, taking on whatever comes your way and keeping your eyes open for the job vacancies . Spread the word too and something will turn up someday for you to get your foot in the door . Lots and lots of people start off in one particular vocation and completely change tack 10 or 15 years or more later . So what if it takes you a couple of years to get what you want, as long as you are doing something in the meantime . I know you say you sometimes find it hard to explain things to people, but I remember you being very good at helping with problems here . Have you ever thought about teaching IT? It doesn't have to be at a school, it could be at a Polytech or something . Anyway, whatever you do, don't give up Kame!! Good luck . :-)	Susan B (19)
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