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Thread ID: 130138 2013-03-27 22:25:00 Persistent Tearing (need knowledgable help tracking cause) Dragoncub (13417) Press F1
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1334345 2013-03-27 22:25:00 An ongoing issue I have had for a looooong time (half a year now), and am having EXTREME difficulty in tracking down . The previous thread ended up getting really cluttered and people asked questions I'd already answered or suggested things I'd already tried . Tried all the basic stuff . Tried a bunch of advanced stuff . Even purchased parts to swap out, so merely figuring out the cause is costing me pocket .
Computer is six months old .
Problem is six months old .
Yep, that's damn right, this is a problem from NEW .

HERE IS MY PROBLEM:
Screen tearing, including at desktop and in any browsers

YES it tears in safe mode
I CANNOT TELL AT BIOS, it is impossible for me to be sure since the most clear tests (moving a black box on a white background, moving around windows, watching video, etc) aren't available there .
AT ALL TIMES, desktop, browsers, Photoshop, Sai, MS PAINT, you name it, it tears it . Only exceptions:
. . . in SOME GAMES (like . . . four or five of them) in-game vsync DOES fix it, but it is atrocious without it, and some require very specific settings (Far Cry 3 requires fullscreen, anything else tears) .



HERE ARE THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN TRIED AND RULED OUT:

It is not heat related . No seriously . Multiple heat checks with a couple different programmes, and anyway the problem is always there, even from cold boot in Safe Mode, it is ever-present .
. . no seriously . Even after playing intensive games with their settings up to 'ultra', the PC sits at a cool ~35*C for the motherboard and ~50*C for the CPU .
Nothing to do with clock speeds . Is still, as it has always been, running at stock speeds, because NEW . (Maybe not anymore, since all the time trying to FIX IT . )
Drivers have been reinstalled many times, both beta, and old versions YES the majority of these were COMPLETELY CLEAN, including using third-party programmes to remove components using safe mode Monitor refresh rates were at 60Hz, as they should be, as they already were
Catalyst Control Centre reinstalled at least twice
Computer clean of any sticky dust or residue, not the cause
Graphics card was (and is) firmly seated, with no faults in the cooling system
Temporary different graphics card was tested (still tearing), while waiting for
. . . replacement graphics card, still tearing
Monitor drivers up to date, using DVI-DVI cabling (monitor supports DVI/AVG and card supports DVI/HDMI so this is my only adapter-free option)
Complete reformat of entire system done, fixed NOTHING
Catalyst Control Centre, syncing always ON - didn't work
Catalyst Control Centre, syncing always OFF (just in case - didn't work obviously)
OpenGL triple buffer tried both on and off - NO CHANGE
I am NOT using crossfireX .
Running mode changed from High Performance to Balanced at BIOS just in case, STILL GODDAMN TEARS
Memory test done - all cards, all slots, STILL TEARS LIKE A MOFO

. . . bunch of others things I forget and will update here when I remember because seriously, so many things guys, so many


STRESS TEST PROGRAMMES HAVE NOT BEEN RUN:
The links the other users sent me are broken, and the HDD I was backing up with is no longer available . (I cannot afford my own currently, so I must wait to borrow it again . )
Feel free to recommend some stress tests you trust, however, for when I am able to backup .


RELIABILITY MONITOR & STABILITY HISTORY

CRITICAL: Lots of hardware failures months ago, from back when Borderlands 2 would cause my graphics drivers to crash and 'recover'
CRITICAL: Lots of "[application] stopped working" from predictably buggy games like ME3 & FONV (I don't think they're related, the games are rather unstable)
WARNING: A large number of 'unsuccessful driver installations', many for graphics (though not all) . Since graphics drivers were what I was almost exclusively installing for the past five-to-six months, hardly surprising that they are mostly graphics .


GRAPHICS CARD, SYSTEM AND DISPLAY

Windows 7 64-bit
AMD Radeon HD 7800 series (exact unspecified in dxdiag)
4x 4GB RAM (16GB total)
Monitor 1920x1080 Philips 236VL
Process is Intel i7-3770, 3 . 40GHz
BIOS Asus



REGARDING WARRANTY (BECAUSE PEOPLE KEPT ASKING) AND TESTING OPTIONS
Technically yes under warranty . This was a contracted custom build, so yes, all of its parts ARE under warranty if they need replacing, but they are NOT designed to play nice exclusively for each other as a pre-built would .
HOWEVER: The freight for the tower would be over sixty dollars (and probably more trying to find a suitable box to protect it) . The delay would be at least a week . I have ALREADY sent off the graphics card to be replaced to no avail, so sending off the entire tower is a LAST RESORT .

Also, people suggesting swapping parts for parts - not really possible . I already bought a card to test with while my first was being replaced (which fixed nothing) but if you want me to try parts in someone else's computer, the majority of the people I know with computers that may be willing to let me poke actually have Macs (barring one who has a tiny little laptop instead) . Yeah, Macs use the same hardware as PCs and are ultimately window-dressing, whatever their users may what to think, but actually getting INTO a Mac is both impossible and . . . considering Apple's lawyers? Probably illegal . 		Dragoncub (13417)
1334346 2013-03-27 22:50:00 Well you have pretty much ruled out software as a fault. I'd bite the bullet and get it sent away for repair. Unless you value your time at zero $60 is cheap to get it sent away so it's someone elses problem. Alex B (15479)
1334347 2013-03-27 23:34:00 I stopped reading at CCC....sorry mate, but I just stay away from AMD. The 7xxx series has been full of bug since day 1, and while most of the issues are around CF, the combination of some hardware can cause issues with sGPU combos....
You seem to be knowledgeable regarding the use of v-sync and as that hasnt resolved the issue, i would RMA the card (have you tested in another PC?).... 		SolMiester (139)
1334348 2013-03-28 00:12:00 Take a photo of this tearing? Chilling_Silence (9)
1334349 2013-03-28 01:25:00 •Temporary different graphics card was tested (still tearing), while waiting for
•...replacement graphics card, still tearing

•WARNING: A large number of 'unsuccessful driver installations', many for graphics (though not all). Could also be a motherboard Problem. In simple terms, if the board has a fault it can impact on all / Any other components including the operations of the Graphic Card in any mode (safe or Normal). 		wainuitech (129)
1334350 2013-03-28 01:46:00 A few questions if I may:

1. What motherboard?
2. Have you tried the onboard graphics?
3. What was the "different temporary card"?
4. Whereabouts are you? (in case there is someone nearby willing to help troubleshoot - I'm in Albany and would be happy to help)


FWIW I don't think the generalisations about AMD are helpful. I've personally used 9800 Pro, HD2900, HD3850 (single and crossfire), HD4850 (single and crossfire), HD5850 (single and crossfire), HD6850 (single and crossfire), and HD7850 (single and crossfire), all with only *minor* issues in *some* games. 		pablo d (15490)
1334351 2013-03-28 02:26:00 Maybe an obvious question but have you tried a different monitor ? dugimodo (138)
1334352 2013-03-28 02:30:00 Maybe an obvious question but have you tried a different monitor ? That's a good question too :D pablo d (15490)
1334353 2013-03-28 03:56:00 I'm in agreement with the rest of the people here, If several cards present the same problem and nothing changes then there's * probably* something amiss with the mobo. Ship it back for $60, your post seems like you have exhausted all reasonable options. $60 to RMA the whole thing and get the people who built it to fix it (as they should have in the first place) The Error Guy (14052)
1334354 2013-03-28 04:46:00 I stopped reading at CCC....sorry mate, but I just stay away from AMD. The 7xxx series has been full of bug since day 1, and while most of the issues are around CF, the combination of some hardware can cause issues with sGPU combos....
You seem to be knowledgeable regarding the use of v-sync and as that hasnt resolved the issue, i would RMA the card (have you tested in another PC?)....

I did consider that. The fact that GAME vsync works but CCC vsync does NOT made me wonder if it were a software fault. However, searching for related problems others users may have yielded nothing, and the temporary card was an Nvidia GeForce with the same problem.




A few questions if I may:

1. What motherboard?
2. Have you tried the onboard graphics?
3. What was the "different temporary card"?
4. Whereabouts are you? (in case there is someone nearby willing to help troubleshoot - I'm in Albany and would be happy to help)


FWIW I don't think the generalisations about AMD are helpful. I've personally used 9800 Pro, HD2900, HD3850 (single and crossfire), HD4850 (single and crossfire), HD5850 (single and crossfire), HD6850 (single and

crossfire), and HD7850 (single and crossfire), all with only *minor* issues in *some* games.

1: Motherboard is an Asus. Looking at the info the builder had for me: "Asus/ Gigabyte New B75 Chipset, LGA1155, ~USB 3. 0 & SATA3 6Gb/s Support". Make of that, what you will.
2: No onboard graphics. If there is no card, there are no graphics.
3: Nvidia 8600 GT. Wanted something at least capable of some output since I was testing with games, and wanted to be able to run them.
4: Based in Hastings, Hawke's Bay. If I DID live near Albany, I would have gotten this fixed a damn-sight faster, since the seller is in Mt Eden and I wouldn't have to wait so long or pay so much. :c

As for AMD being the problem, I can't say for sure either way. I considered it, since GAME sync worked but COMPUTER sync didn't, but I couldn't find any online support for it, and I had tearing even when using an Nvidia card temporarily.
I've noticed a strange 'shimmer' effect when panning while playing Far Cry 3, where the images flicker back and forth, as well as flashing artifacts (a problem I had with the previous iteration of this card model, that seems to be fixed now... mostly?) It COULD be CCC/card fault - the Nvidia wasn't tested with FC3 but it didn't have artifacts like my first Radeon did.




Maybe an obvious question but have you tried a different monitor ?
Yep. I bought the peripherals over time (the tower was its own purchase), so I had two monitors. I only ended up using one, but it meant I had a second to test with. Nothin' doin'. They WERE bought at the same time, so if there was a problem with the line it could be common to both, but I HIGHLY doubt it. A fault like this would warrant a recall and it would be noticed in a batch test anyway if it hit the whole group. 		Dragoncub (13417)
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