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Thread ID: 127549	2012-10-30 04:19:00	Stop or not	rny (6943)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
1309549	2012-10-30 22:45:00	Back when I had a couple of driving lessons prior to getting my license the instructor told me the easiest way to behave at stop signs is come to a complete stop, say to yourself "S,T,O,P" and then carry on. Gives that little moment of stopping before carrying on which is what the cops like to see.	Bozo (8540)
1309550	2012-10-31 00:10:00	I always understood it to be a "full and complete halt" and not a specified time, perhaps things have changed since I sat my licence. There was a story going around ages back which may have been an urban legend about someone who pulled up to a stop sign, rolled back slighty, then proceeded and got fined for failing to stop. In court they supposedly quoted the Laws of Motion that basically say you can't change direction (ie roll back) without coming to a stop and got the fine overturned. In any case my feeling is as long as you do actually stop and have checked both directions before proceeding you have obeyed the intent of the law. They do occasionally put stop signs in stupid places though - there was one locally that has since become a give way that for years had a stop sign on a left turn into a merging lane with excellent visibility - you could turn left and get up to speed without conflicting with straight through traffic but legally you had to stop. And as for the cyclist thing, I must confess to ignoring a few road rules in my cycle days. You can do things on a bike that cars can't, like turn left and stay on the verge so you aren't actually in the lane right turning traffic turns into (no longer so relevant since they changed the turning laws). Personally I would avoid intersections and roundabouts quite often by using the footpath providing there were no pedestrians around. I consider that a lesser evil than running a light or a stop sign and lets be honest here, as long as care is taken who does it actually hurt? Yes there are a lot of bad cyclists around, but there are a lot of good ones as well. Cycling in city traffic is dangerous and most motorists don't give them a second thought, I don't use my bike much now because the traffic intimidates me. Roundabouts especially seem designed to kill cyclists, if you keep left traffic cuts you off, if you ride in the centre of the lane like you really should traffic gets held up and impatient drivers follow way too close.	dugimodo (138)
1309551	2012-10-31 02:30:00	Pfft. Kettle , black ?? Cyclists dont give a damn about pedestrians. Cyclists rarely stop at pedestrian crossings, often bolt on through at full speed despite the pedestrians trying to cross. They even tear on through while pedestrians are part way across the zebra crossing Ive seen this, often.	1101 (13337)
1309552	2012-10-31 02:52:00	Pfft. Kettle , black ?? Cyclists dont give a damn about pedestrians. Cyclists rarely stop at pedestrian crossings, often bolt on through at full speed despite the pedestrians trying to cross. They even tear on through while pedestrians are part way across the zebra crossing Ive seen this, often. Pull your collar up - your red neck is showing.	user (1404)
1309553	2012-10-31 03:04:00	Cyclists dont give a damn about pedestrians. That sounds like it might be a little bit of a generalisation. ;) Cyclists rarely stop at pedestrian crossings, often bolt on through at full speed despite the pedestrians trying to cross. They even tear on through while pedestrians are part way across the zebra crossing I walk or cycle, and never drive. I've never had a cyclist do this, and as a cyclist, I don't do it. the plural of anecdote isn't data, obviously, but I think "rarely" may be a bit hyperbolic. I wish cyclists would stay off the footpath, though; as a pedestrian, this is my number one irritation about cyclists.	Zara Baxter (16260)
1309554	2012-10-31 06:59:00	Stop means stop. Hardly rocket science and it would be longer than 3 seconds even in an auto car. Cyclists are the worst I give them the horn and fingers when the ride straight through. I have an over whelming urge then to smash them off their bike when I catch up to them and they sure dont get their 750mm car to bike separation. I wish people caught for not stopping at stops signs lost their licence for life. For buses I ring the company with bus number time and intersection. I would prefer that cyclist who obey the law like me could have a rocket launcher to take out idiot drives who don't leave enough room	gary67 (56)
1309555	2012-10-31 07:09:00	That sounds like it might be a little bit of a generalisation. ;) I walk or cycle, and never drive. I've never had a cyclist do this, and as a cyclist, I don't do it. the plural of anecdote isn't data, obviously, but I think "rarely" may be a bit hyperbolic. I wish cyclists would stay off the footpath, though; as a pedestrian, this is my number one irritation about cyclists.im in Wellington, and see this behaviour by cyclists everyday. The CBD has some awful cyclists, not to mention the hutt valley	plod (107)
1309556	2012-10-31 07:48:00	This cyclist vs motorist 'debate' is pointless (and has very little to do with the original topic of this thread) . Everyone knows there is a percentage of cyclists who are idiots and flout the road rules . There is a similar percentage of motorists (in all types of motorised vehicles) who flout the road rules . There are a hell of a lot more motorists on the road than cyclists, therefore, although the percentage may be similar, the actual number of idiots on the roads driving motor vehicles far exceeds cyclists . For every claim of "I often see cyclists doing x", I can say, hand on heart, that "I often see motorists doing x, more often" . The self-limiting part of the equation is the fact that a cyclist who takes a chance and loses is far more likely not to be in a position to take a similar risk again . Unlike a motorist, who has a two tonne metal frame around him(/her), and is far more likely to come off with a just bit of repairable panelwork, following a stupid/illegal manoeuvre . . . Additionally, as I stated above, a cyclist can't do as much damage to a motorist as a motorist can do to a cyclist .	johcar (6283)
1309557	2012-10-31 09:01:00	Pull your collar up - your red neck is showing. That is a bit rough, you can't drive anywhere in downtown Auckland without seeing cycle couriers ignoring every (applicable) traffic law in the book. I nearly cleaned one up an an intersection quite recently, and I am not into jack-rabbit starts or traffic-light drag races. I took off at a leisurely pace and the cyclist (at full warp) missed me by the skin of his teeth. If I had been any quicker off the mark he would have been inside my seatbelt. Drivers are bad enough I agree, but I hate to say it, cyclists are among the worst offenders on the road and it is often just good luck that they survive. Many certainly do not use good judgement. Two abreast on blind corners is a sure way to meet your maker, especially on the open road. Cheers Billy 8-{)	Billy T (70)
1309558	2012-10-31 21:08:00	That is a bit rough, you can't drive anywhere in downtown Auckland without seeing cycle couriers ignoring every (applicable) traffic law in the book . I nearly cleaned one up an an intersection quite recently, and I am not into jack-rabbit starts or traffic-light drag races . I took off at a leisurely pace and the cyclist (at full warp) missed me by the skin of his teeth . If I had been any quicker off the mark he would have been inside my seatbelt . Drivers are bad enough I agree, but I hate to say it, cyclists are among the worst offenders on the road and it is often just good luck that they survive . Many certainly do not use good judgement . Two abreast on blind corners is a sure way to meet your maker, especially on the open road . Cheers Billy 8-{) Not really . Many people have ingrained 'redneck' attitudes concerning cyclists and make broad idiotic generalisations based on a small percentage of offenders, tarring the entire community of cyclists with the same brush . I see a few idiot motorists (including courier vans) on the road but I don't generalise to include all motorists when I complain about the offending motorists . A lot of motorists I meet on the road are considerate and courteous . A lot of cyclists on the road are considerate and courteous . Don't lose sight of the big picture . When I rode a motorcycle, the same bad feeling existed between motorists and motorcyclists .	user (1404)
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