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Thread ID: 32661	2003-04-24 22:09:00	WFTWE #47.....Oriflamme.....ANZAC Day, more than just another holiday....	Billy T (70)	Press F1

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
138664	2003-04-24 22:09:00	Oriflamme A banner, symbol or ideal dedicated to devotion or courage The Gallipoli campaign may have been an abject failure, but all those Poppies mean something. Nobody can deny the courage or the sacrifice on both sides of the conflict. Visiting Gallipoli is one of the most profoundly moving experiences a Kiwi can have. Billy 8-{) :|	Billy T (70)
138665	2003-04-25 00:47:00	Didn't get to visit Gallipoli while overseas, but visited Mathausen concentration camp and Monte Casino. There is a distinct feeling from these places which is kinda scarey. Very hard to explain, but gave a deeper understanding to the sufferings of others, and a feeling of " I'm glad I didn't have to go through it".So many graves with the heading "Known only unto God" Definitely not what you would expect from all the war movies we were brought up on.	Pheonix (280)
138666	2003-04-25 02:01:00	And here was me expecting this would be another word meaning something to do with specail cuddles, losing black knickers, or some other similar meaning... :D Hows about some links Gallipoli Billy T ?? .Clueless	Clueless (181)
138667	2003-04-25 05:07:00	>And here was me expecting this would be another word meaning something to do with specail cuddles, losing black knickers, or some other similar meaning . . . Is D still over the other side of the hills, Clueless? Feeling lonely? I have just read a recent book published in Oz by three writers, two of whom are of Turkish origin . It is called "Gallipoli: the Turkish story" . Excellent to get the other side of the picture . Shows the ANZACS as being involved in someone else's war, and as invaders, whilst the Turks were defending their own land . Not a bad perspective to get . It doesn't blame, diminish, or otherwise dump on the ANZACS - it just looks at the conflict from the other side . Well written, though with a strong bias towards the Australian experience . Both my daughters have been to the dawn service at Gallipoli and were bowled over by it . One brought home an old bullet that a Turkish guide gave her . I don't like handling it for obvious reasons . The other daughter climbed up to Chunuk Bair with a mixed group of Oz and Kiwi friends, and got a great deal of satisfaction pointing out how far back Lone Pine was - the furthest place the Aussies got to . Whoops, not good for trans Tasman relationships . . .	John H (8)
138668	2003-04-25 05:27:00	Thanks for the enquiry John. >Is D still over the other side of the hills, Clueless? Feeling lonely? D and i have just spent an extended weekend of 5 hectic days bouncing from one side of the island and back, and back, and back again. Yes your right, the Southern Alps between us once again. I'd still like to see some Gallipoli links (too lazy to go get some) .Clueless	Clueless (181)
138669	2003-04-27 06:29:00	I've been out of town since posting WFTWE, hence my uncharacteristic silence. I found some good Gallipoli links a while back, I'll dig them out and post. I didn't want to presume the PF1 response to ANZAC day, but since it seems positive I'll add some links. I too visited a concentration camp in Europe but although that shocked me to the core, nothing prepared me for the overwhelming sadness of Gallipoli. I guess it is the Kiwi connection and all those small town memorials that brings it home. Billy 8-{) :|	Billy T (70)
138670	2003-04-27 11:12:00	Okay Team, here's some links: You can start with A History of the ANZAC Day celebrations (www.nzhistory.net.nz) then follow that with Some photos (user.glo.be) these can be enlarged by clicking. The text is on a black background so to read it easily you need to highlight it. (There is quite a lot of info on this site.) Next you can try The Aussie Government Viewpoint (www.anzacsite.gov.au/) then finish up with A New Zealand student's view. (http:) Finally, below is a poem written by my son two years ago (when aged 11) for his school ANZAC Day studies. After writing this he decided of his own accord to honour the ANZAC memory by marching in the local parade wearing his Grandfather's medals. Anzac Memories Soldiers, waking at dawn, peparing for War. Rifles ready, boots polished, all set for the long sail to Gallipoli. The soldiers are sad for what they will leave, and frightened for what will come. Later, in a foreign land, Shooting, bombing, chaos flows, as soldiers die for freedom, Soldiers who won't be coming home again. We rise before dawn 83 years later, on 25th of April to lay wreaths, wear poppies and march, sing hymns, watch flags raise and lower, to remember those who gave their lives for our freedom. Billy 8-{) :|	Billy T (70)
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