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Thread ID: 36321	2003-08-06 04:40:00	The "Sky" thing	John Grieve (367)	Press F1

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
165795	2003-08-07 07:53:00	Heres the words I have used in search engines so far. law, sky, signal decoding protection, encryption, television, pay tv, decryption, signal, broadcasting, radiocommunications, telecommunications, conditional access system, cracking, hacking, protect encryption, government, tv, nz, new zealand, videocrypt and also the names of the TVCard and the software to do the cracking (which I will not name as we still are not sure what the legal situation is). I used various combos of those words in sentences etc.	John Grieve (367)
165796	2003-08-07 09:05:00	> Heres the words I have used in search engines so > far. > > law, sky, signal decoding protection, encryption, > television, pay tv, decryption, signal, broadcasting, > radiocommunications, telecommunications, conditional > access system, cracking, hacking, protect encryption, > government, tv, nz, new zealand, videocrypt and also > the names of the TVCard and the software to do the > cracking (which I will not name as we still are not > sure what the legal situation is). I used various > combos of those words in sentences etc. Once again your looking for specific cases, this only happens in the courts, the courts are only part of the legal system. Let me put it in a scenario for you. Would it be ok if i tampered your locks to get into your house so that i could eat your food? No it wouldn't because its against the law, do you know the specific law that prohibits this? probably not. The same goes for sky you are tampering with there property (the frequency they transmitt on) so you can watch the images (eat the food) PRINCIPALS! your previous post in regards to my comments shows your ignorance. It happened with your telecom discussion and its happening here again. surprise surprise.	roofus (483)
165797	2003-08-07 09:12:00	I could however find the exact law prohibiting you from entering my house and eating my food unlike the law about decoding the sky UHF signal......or have you found it?	John Grieve (367)
165798	2003-08-07 09:36:00	Its good you bringing up the Telecom thing as I always wanted to finalise it. Basically my argument was if for several years I had data sertvice on my phone of a consistent quality then I should be able to rely on the fact that the "Quality of service" would not degrade beyond that level for any reason. Like I had the best possible phoneline based data link and why would it get worse and how could Telecom justify it getting worse (went to pretty consistent 28.8k from a rock solid 99% of the time 53.3k which was more than sufficient for online gaming, which by the way I have not done since the "atrocity" happened). So I thought at least I had some leverage. However Telecoms attitude went "We do not garantee any minimum data rate at all on your line" and "we find no problem with your upgraded phone line" in that the phone worked perfectly and the only thing Telecom actually garantees is the phone works without any sort of problem. In other words "piss off we don't care and we have no legal responsibility in this at all" and thats how it is to this day. I connect with my carefully bought and expensive modem at 28.8k 90% of the time and 31.2k the rest in the middle of Auckland the biggest glossiest city in NZ. Thanks Telecom (and they appear to have raised my phoneline charge on the last bill too!! :D ). They tell us the customer they love us and are here for us and then thats what they do to me. They are dead right I have no real recourse. They have every right to lower the rate at which my modem connects with their equipment...me and you and you and you and you all have the same rights in this particular situation....none whatsoever.	John Grieve (367)
165799	2003-08-07 21:24:00	> I could however find the exact law prohibiting you > from entering my house and eating my food unlike the > law about decoding the sky UHF signal......or have > you found it? BUT the law won't specifically say you can't tamper with locks and steal food. It'll say breaking and entering and stealing is wrong. In this case you're breaking and entering (the decoding of the signal) and stealing the Sky signal, and that's wrong. Law in NZ doesn't come down to specifics, it's very broad and it's up to the courts to define it if necessary. But they usually won't move the line to say one thing is stealing, one thing isn't. In this case they'd more than likely say it's stealing. That's how the law and the courts work in NZ. Mike.	Mike (15)
165800	2003-08-07 23:48:00	thanks Mike for backing me up, however I don't think John is listening. John if you really want to know, i suggest you contact your lawyer.	roofus (483)
165801	2003-08-07 23:59:00	Believe it or not I have asked 3 lawyers to find out. None of them specialise in broadcasting/communications law though and could not off the top of their heads tell me. All 3 have promised to find out within a couple of weeks as all 3 have no idea how the law might be worked in this case. If and when I get a real answer from all 3 that matches I intend to let everybody know. I was a real piece of work when I was young. I appeared in court on a wide variety of charges and in every case in court it went Mr Grieve under section XXX Subsection XXX Clause XXX you are charged with blah blah blah So thats what I want to know. And just as a little aside I was actually charged with stealing electricity once ($1.86c worth believe it or not) and there was a "under section blah blah read out in the court. It was in my student days in Dunedin so starving student etc etc.	John Grieve (367)
165802	2003-08-08 00:05:00	Hiya Terry, the same thing is done here too. There are numerous satellites (?) that broadcast free to air TV programs from other countries and these have 'footprints' that cover NZ, not intentionally of course, but some do. There is a website, Auzzie I think dont know the URL now, but it provide's details for Aust/NZ coverage, from memory think there were about 35 odd stations available here. The problem is that a larger dish antenna is almost always required.	Tobas (224)
165803	2003-08-08 00:33:00	Try the Copyright Act. (here (www.vanuatu.usp.ac.fj)) One possibility, in that this act (it may have beed superceded but the principles will apply) would give copyright status to the entire broadcast, and subscribing would entitle you to a licence to view. It enshrines the Broadcasting Corporation but a little clause also covers any private company broadcasting in the same manner.	godfather (25)
165804	2003-08-08 04:40:00	It says there GF, as interpreted by, that the breach takes place on the reception of the broadcast which suggests receiving the signal with a receiver is a breach of copyright ie, capturing the signal to decode is not legal. However it also says you can copy said signal for private use, can you alter it though (decode)?. Might be best to stay safe and stick to the 50 year term at which copyright ceases in NZ. Cheers Murray P	Murray P (44)
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