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Thread ID: 42077	2004-01-31 06:50:00	Linux - convince me it's worth it - No flaming please	chiefnz (545)	Press F1

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
211818	2004-02-02 09:25:00	Well tbacon after reading your post I am reminded of an old addage I once heard... it goes something like this... "Before a man becomes old and wise he has to first be young and stupid!!!" Although you make very valid points regarding Linux's installation friendliness I would'nt say it's a toy... I can understand that you want an OS that comes straight out of the box ready to use, this is of course your perogative and dare I say after the experiences you may have seen over the years it's probably a well earned right. As for me, well this whole Linux trip has not only been a great learning experience but it has also rejuvinated my interest in computing, I have a long ways to go and no doubt I will find myself in stickier situations... but then again those are precisely the reasons mankind has come this far... not cos the use of fire, the wheel and electricity came out of a box but they arose from man's curiosity and drive to make things better. I for one do not believe that Windows will be completely stamped out but I tell you what Linux is and always will be here to stay, no matter what. Ok how's that opening speech for a newbie Linux convert cough cough :( sorry throat's sore cheers chiefnz	chiefnz (545)
211819	2004-02-02 09:49:00	Jeez, chiefnz, that's a bit philosophical for 10:30 at night! I suspect I will have a go at Linux sometime, and who knows, it might even get me excited too... Tony	tbacon_nz (865)
211820	2004-02-02 10:21:00	>Ok how's that opening speech for a newbie Linux convert That is a great speech chiefnz, sums it up nicely :D I see Chill is going to see you right with Fedora and the 2.6 kernel. I also run Fedora and updated to 2.6 myself and it is great. If you are running KDE, the latest version 3.2 will be apparently released for download this weekend, and from what I have heard, it is really fast and greatly improved. BTW, your XMMS went nuts before because the link I gave you was for the plugin for Red Hat 9 (this was before you mentioned it was actually RH8). RH8 comes with xmms- 1.2.7-13 so the plugin didn't not match your version. Keep with it, I too am impressed with the self-help effort you have put in :)	Jen C (20)
211821	2004-02-02 11:10:00	tbacon_nz> Not all experiences are this bad... My Family's now happy running Ark Linux (Alpha 10). They dont know its Alpha software, but it worked out of the box! It was so simple I got my 8 yr old Brother to help run the install. Ark Linux simply "Worked". Digital Camera? We've got a FujiFilm FinePix S304. Plugged it in and it worked immediately, no drivers needed, nothing! How long did it take me to set it up on a Win2K box a month or two back? Around 1 1/2 hours.... If cheifnz doesnt object, I'll bring around my Case of Linux Disc's, and we can talk a bit about the possibilities of Fedora. Might make life easier ;-) The thing is.... A lot of the time Linux can simply "Work". ...That's why you dont see many posts around here on simple linux matters ;-) Chill.	Chilling_Silently (228)
211822	2004-02-02 22:42:00	I guess chill the family didn't have to pay for there "alpha" software hah ;) Interesting comment about MS Windows being "straight foward" having installed quite a number of windows boxes most seem to come up with some sort of problem or other, non have been a wave the magic wand and everything is oakley doakly. Even OEM install cds general wipe your previous setup. With Linux, or any other non-MS OS for that matter, thinking "outside the square" is a good thing. It is a learning experience even if one decides to stick with MS Windows as there primary OS of choice.	mark.p (383)
211823	2004-02-02 23:28:00	>>thinking "outside the square" is a good thing. No argument there, but installing an OS should not be that sort of exercise. An OS is a means to an end - getting productive stuff done, not an end in itself.	tbacon_nz (865)
211824	2004-02-02 23:55:00	A lot of unproductive stuff is done as well. And not every Linux install is hard. As Chill said a vast number "just work". Its a highly customisable ( I don't just mean pretty pics and icons :), versitile OS. Works on a multitude of platforms(an advantage, as MS have cut the types of platforms NT based windows are able to be installed on).	mark.p (383)
211825	2004-02-03 00:27:00	The major problem here is trying to use the latest hardware. Depending on the cooperation of the manufacturers (3Com have usually been good) drivers for popular equipment usually become available in a reasonable time. Some hardware is never supported in Linux -- because the manufacturers won't release the essential information. Some new hardware will never be supported for very old levels of the OS; some older hardware isn't supported in Windows XP.:D -- It seems that this is an older version of the OS: still a good one , but no OS can "out of the box" handle hardware which is produced after it was released. Let's see you make a USB device work on Windows 95A. As I said early on here --- a cheap 10/100 NIC would work. There are very good lists of the hardware which is supported. The rest of the problems are just a matter of learning. Anyone who expects to boot from a CD and immediately know all the details of a *nux OS is an idjeet. IT'S NOT BLOODY WINDOWS. It's different. It's a real OS. That's why it's so good. There are some very good books around. Most of them are much lighter than the books on Windows. (And they aren't just a hard copy of the Help. :D) They usually come with a free copy of the OS.:D There are very good books on line. There's a lot of reading in the HOWTOson the distribution disks. Look for Rute, and the Linux Cookbook.	Graham L (2)
211826	2004-02-03 06:05:00	Very well said Graham... Linux isnt Windows... I believe a lot of people expect Linux to be something like ReactOS (http://www.reactos.com/). ....Funny thing that.. It isnt... You _will_ have to learn a few OS-Specific things, but it would be the same if you were trying Solaris! </rant> Chill.	Chilling_Silently (228)
211827	2004-02-03 10:06:00	There is a difference between having to know how to use a new OS and expecting it to install without lots of research and downloading extra stuff and compiling etc . Of course Linux is not Windows (for which we should be truly grateful), and if I am moving to a new OS I am quite prepared to put the time in to learn how to use it, just as I had to spend time when I moved from Win98 to WinXP . What I do expect though is that the basic nuts and bolts all work without me having to worry about them . Whenever I see a magazine article titled "Linux Ready for the Desktop", you get a little way into the article and there will be a bit that says "I had a little trouble with xyz, but I downloaded and compiled abc and then it was all fine . " I don't want an OS that requires me to know all this stuff up front . I want the thing to install without trouble, and then I am happy to invest time in learning how to use it efficiently and tweak it to my satisfaction . But the underlying stuff has to work . Now as I understand it the Linux kernel is very stable and efficient, and that's great, but until "Linux install goes haywire - thousands weep" is the big story because it is so unexpected, you are not going to get anything like a mass migration to the OS . I suspect there will be some Linux devotees who would be quite sad at this state of affairs because it would mean that there was nothing left for them to play with and have secret knowledge of, but I think there will always be stuff that can be done, because Linux is so customisable and therefore infinitely malleable . [/rant]	tbacon_nz (865)
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