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Thread ID: 47329	2004-07-23 06:12:00	OT: Online Stock brokers	fergie (424)	Press F1

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
254574	2004-07-23 06:12:00	Hi all. Hey, i'm looking to get into the world of teh share market. To tell you the truth, i don't really know that much about how it all works, but i have some spare $$ i wouldn't mind having a play with. I'm needing a stock/share broker tho. I have heard alot allow you to buy/sell over the net (is this true) if so, could some of you please recomend some? I'm looking for one that does the following: 1) NZ based 2) Allows to buy and sell NZ shares over the internet & check the current rates real time 3) has low fees (how much do they charge?) and, how does it work - if you say u want 100 shares in company X, you have set up an account etc with them, how do you pay them? can you pay via direct credit? can they take teh funds out themselves? Also - can you buy overseas shares? And if theres anything else i should no - let me no. cheers	fergie (424)
254575	2004-07-23 06:15:00	www.sharechat.co.nz	godfather (25)
254576	2004-07-23 06:20:00	cool, thanks for that GF	fergie (424)
254577	2004-07-23 07:55:00	Per godfathers link - access brokerage have some of the best rates around but traditionally they have not offered advice although I believe that has changed recently. I personally use them and for larger transactions you can negotiate better brokerage rates. As far as the brokers recommendations go, they can only be described as a WOFTAM. They never commit to anything (what exactly do they mean by accumulate?) until it is too late and the cynics amongst us believe they adopt contrary positions to what they advise....but don't get me started on brokers.... I recommend starting with a virtual portfolio to see how you fare and to gain experience - you can always use the nz herald online site (portfolio.nzherald.co.nz) to have a practice at running a portfolio - there may be others available. Be aware the nz herald sites leave behind tracking cookies - but nothing ad-aware can't handle. I also recommend sticking to NZ shares - despite our geographical proximity to Australia, we may as well be a million miles away when it comes to staying informed with what Aussie businesses are doing - unless you are relying on a broker (see previous comments). Plus we all know that the Aussies are the grandsons of sheep stealers....why would you trust your money with an Aussie? :D Forget international shares until you have a handle on NZ shares first. To check online prices you can look here (www.nzx.com/), here (http:) or here (www.accessbrokerage.co.nz/) but there is about a 20-30 minute delay for these free services. You will also need to know the 3 character ticker code for each company which you will find here (http:). For more basic info have a look here (www.nzx.com) and I also recommend buying a book or two to read up on some of the fundamentals - stay away from technical analysts (chartists) who believe that past performance is an indicator of future performance - this is utter bollocks and don't waste your time or money on technical analysis. All debates welcomed on this opinion. ;D Lastly, IMHO the sharemarket is 50% fundamentals and 50% emotion. The increased riskiness, by definition, means higher returns than other forms of investing, but on the other side of the coin it is also possible to have sub-normal returns and if you are unlucky enough then you can even incur losses. Riskiness = variability = volatility. That is part of the fun - how to get yourself out of a potential super-loss position. Think tower, robert jones, brierley, tv3, wilson neill, air nz, bnz, chase, equiticorp(se) etc etc etc. BTW, as more novices enter the market I am getting the signals to get out - when cab drivers, shoe-shine boys and hairdressers start dishing out stock tips then you know the crash is only a matter of days or weeks away. But if you take only one thing away from what I have posted, remember this : Efficient markets (such as the stock market) facilitate the transfer of wealth from the impatient to the patient.	andrew93 (249)
254578	2004-07-23 08:40:00	lol, thanks for that Andrew. Provided me with alot of info, cheers. I've been looking around a few brokers now, and i'm liking ASB securities = http://www.asbsecurities.co.nz/ I'm still reading, but i see thay have a "cash management account' and if my reading is correct - does this let you open an aco**** with ASB, put money in, and when you buy/sell shares - the money comes from/goes to this account? If so - this it what i'm aftr (i want a separate account for all this) And what are your thoughts on their rates: www.asbsecurities.co.nz Its $25 for a 'brokerage fee' on what i'll be doing. But whats a brokerage fee - when do you pay this? just when you're buying shares? what about selling? Is this high? From what i've read - they seem to haev everything i'm after, and sound really good, but is that $25 fee expensive? Thanks	fergie (424)
254579	2004-07-23 08:42:00	> lol, thanks for that Andrew. > Provided me with alot of info, cheers. you're welcome > I've been looking around a few brokers now, and i'm > liking ASB securities = > http://www.asbsecurities.co.nz/ > > I'm still reading, but i see thay have a "cash > management account' and if my reading is correct - > does this let you open an aco**** with ASB, put money > in, and when you buy/sell shares - the money comes > from/goes to this account? yes > If so - this it what i'm aftr (i want a separate > account for all this) > > And what are your thoughts on their rates: > www.asbsecurities.co.nz > Its $25 for a 'brokerage fee' on what i'll be doing. > But whats a brokerage fee - when do you pay this? > just when you're buying shares? what about selling? yes - you pay brokerage on buying and selling > Is this high? no, that's a good rate > From what i've read - they seem to haev everything > i'm after, and sound really good, but is that $25 fee > expensive? > Thanks Good luck :)	andrew93 (249)
254580	2004-07-23 08:43:00	o, and another thing, I'm also wanting to get some US and AUS currency, keep it for a while, sell whne teh NZ$ loses value. But you can't put this in a standard NZ bank account aye? I was just reading on the ASB Securities site - they have a Foreign Currency Account - www.asbsecurities.co.nz Would this let me deposit the foreign currency in there? and would i get interest? and how much is it to deposit/withdraw from there (i've sent them an email asking all this - but i don't expect a reply till monday - and i thought some of u guys mite no) Cheers	fergie (424)
254581	2004-07-23 08:53:00	Thansk again when you say: >yes - you pay brokerage on buying and selling does that mean, say i wanna buy 100 shares in Telecom - so i pay the share priuce x 100 - say $600, and then i pay teh $25 fee, so $625. And then, say the share price gets to $7, and i wanna sell - So i'll get $700, i'll then be charged $25 from this? So in the end, i'll make $50? Thanks	fergie (424)
254582	2004-07-23 09:24:00	> Thansk again > when you say: > > yes - you pay brokerage on buying and selling > > does that mean, say i wanna buy 100 shares in Telecom > - so i pay the share priuce x 100 - say $600, and > then i pay teh $25 fee, so $625. yes > And then, say the share price gets to $7, and i wanna > sell - So i'll get $700, i'll then be charged $25 > from this? yes > So in the end, i'll make $50? yes - not good is it? > Thanks The best thing to do is to try and spread the brokerage over a larger value - by buying or selling in minimum lots of $1000 - I usually prefer $1500 to $2000 minimum to spread the cost. The more the better but then you risk having an undiversified portfolio (ask if you want more info on this). But you have raised a good point because transaction costs (such as brokerage) can have a massive impact on your returns. Also, do not, and I repeat, do not buy any managed funds or unit trusts - often the fees involved in administering the fund not only take a good proportion of the annual dividends, but they can also seriously erode the capital. They rely on an increasing market and more investors buying their fund to keep their unit prices up. Look at the returns on WINZ (not the Govt dept) for example - a classic case of what I am talking about. Plus you used a very good example - any NZ stock-tracking fund is going to have 50% of its portfolio in Telecom and based on market capitalisations, you can probably work out what the managed funds also have in companies such as Carter Holt, Auckland Airport, Sky City etc etc. - generally they have to match the market and they base it on market capitalisation (i.e. number of shares in the company times the price) so you don't need to pay a pin-striped twit any fees to do what he does, which is diversification, when you can do it yourself. I'll answer your other question in my next post.	andrew93 (249)
254583	2004-07-23 09:36:00	> o, and another thing, > > I'm also wanting to get some US and AUS currency, > keep it for a while, sell whne teh NZ$ loses value. This is called gambling, not investing. You might as well go to the casino or race-track to try and make some money (their return may actually be better if you keep reading). Main difference between forex, futures and options compared to property, shares and term investments is that the lattter 3 will (should) give you an ongoing return thru rent, dividends and interest. Any capital gain on these is a bonus. With the others you are hoping the price will rise, or fall, depending upon your position. > But you can't put this in a standard NZ bank account > aye? correct > I was just reading on the ASB Securities site - they > have a Foreign Currency Account - > www.asbsecurities.co.nz BNZ also offer NZ forex accounts (or they did some years ago) > Would this let me deposit the foreign currency in > there? yes > and would i get interest? yes but the interest will be less than the monthly fees - per my previous thread this is also a WOFTAM unless you are dealing in lotsa money - but then the bank and Govt will look at you sideways and starting asking questions on any transactions over $2000 (someone correct me if I am wrong with that value) as part of the anti-money laundering legislation. Might be more trouble and risk than it is worth. > and how much is it > to deposit/withdraw from there (i've sent them an > email asking all this - but i don't expect a reply > till monday - and i thought some of u guys mite no) not sure of the transaction costs but it won't be free but see my previous post re transaction fees > Cheers my advice : keep it simple.	andrew93 (249)
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