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Thread ID: 48862	2004-09-03 04:41:00	Best Practise for Computer Repairs?	Captive (3159)	Press F1

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
269000	2004-09-05 13:56:00	horizontal scrollbars 'aint cool www.creightonbrown.geek.nz 'specially for a webdesigner I know it's O/T to the thread but has anyone read right thru Creighton's site? Interesting stuff	45South (4769)
269001	2004-09-05 13:57:00	> ....And what package might that be?? Check Oricon.	drb1 (4492)
269002	2004-09-06 01:05:00	>Rather than regulation why not go for the Darwinian approach? Survivial of the fittest . Actually, it was Herbert Spencer, not Darwin who thought that one up . Darwin used the phrase but fully acknowledged where it came from . And probably Spencer's social/economic views have more relevance to your context than Darwin's biological ones . >Those that provide a shoddy service or over-charge should or would go out of business through having no repeat business Problem is (from consumer viewpoint) that we have inefficient monopolies . (Telecom for anyone???) . Spencer tended to approve of these coz they made those running them get richer ("survival of the fittest") etc . >Let the market forces push the weaker operators aside Only happens for some markets, alternatively depends on what you mean by "operators" . Sometimes innocent consumers/clients, like in the current Access Brokerage fiasco, get pushed aside . I avoided that one, but it's interesting . . . . . . . . . . . . . In a different class from dud painters . . . . . . . .	rugila (214)
269003	2004-09-06 01:09:00	I would imagine there is a differance between protected (telecom) and fittest (me)	metla (154)
269004	2004-09-06 02:02:00	> Actually, it was Herbert Spencer, not Darwin who > thought that one up. thanks rugila, like George W, I tend to "mash & mangle" quotes to the point where all meaning is lost, but unlike W, I'm not putting the world at risk.... :D Speaking of mashed and mangled quotes, I got my negative correlation thingy completely wrong - it should have read perfectly correlated, not negatively correlated.	andrew93 (249)
269005	2004-09-06 05:14:00	>like George W........ but unlike W, I'm not putting the world at risk.... "The ideas of economists and political philosophers, both when they are right and when they are wrong, are more powerful than is commonly understood. Indeed the world is ruled by little else. Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influences, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist. Madmen in authority, who hear voices in the air, are distilling their frenzy from some academic scribbler of a few years back. I am sure that the power of vested interests is vastly exaggerated compared with the gradual encroachment of ideas." J M Keynes. (circa 1936) Nota bene. Of course not referring to andrew93, but maybe George W qualifies. Maybe I should just stick to computer repairs instead of bizarre OT's. I do all my own. No problem - very straightforward. But bizarre OT's really are much more interesting.	rugila (214)
269006	2004-09-06 05:39:00	There is only one rule that will work for the thrust of this thread. Caveat Emptor, with all that that implies. Let the buyer beware. Regulation, whether formal or voluntary will not do it. The power of the consumer will, if the consumer wishes to use that power, but most choose not to. Those of us who do are the bane of shonky tradespersons or professionals. Cheers Billy 8-{)	Billy T (70)
269007	2004-09-06 09:17:00	>There is only one rule that will work for the thrust of this thread. >Caveat Emptor, with all that that implies. >Let the buyer beware. >Regulation, whether formal or voluntary will not do it. Nah, not so! The apposite rule is Caveat Venditor (let the seller beware) with all that that implies. It's only a few cowboy providers of shonky goods, services and "advice" who seem to worry about reasonable regulations to protect consumers. I only had trouble with a computer repair shop once (only time I ever used onein fact) when I tried getting the modem of a G4 powerbook (Mac specialist shop) fixed under guarantee. Took the technician far too long to do it, and while it was eventually done he reckoned the machine wasn't working properly, claimed he reinstallled the OS so it wouild and tried charging me $95. Apart from the facts that that work wasn't requested and the problem was a crook hard drive rather than a dud OS per se, which any competent technician should have determined, he was lucky not to get slogged with the Fair Trading Act. I let Apple Computer pay for the modem, paid nothing myself walked out with machine under my arm. Haven't been into a computer repair establishment since. Then there's the even more interesting case of the new, widely advertised 4-stroke lawnmower I bought (no lack of cowboys in the small engine business). That one went through the Disputes Tribunal under the Consumer Guarantees Act and cost the seller (venditor) a packet. - I had tried unsuccessfully to reason with the guy for some time and eventually said something about the Disputes Tribunal, to which he responded "Don't threaten me!" Poor guy, sellers do sometimes need some help. Is Billy T really concerned about/scared of buyer-protection laws and regulations. Surely not, alternatively why?	rugila (214)
269008	2004-09-06 10:49:00	> > There is only one rule that will work for the thrust > of this thread . > > Caveat Emptor, with all that that implies . > > Let the buyer beware . > > Regulation, whether formal or voluntary will not do > it . > > Nah, not so! > The apposite rule is Caveat Venditor (let the seller > beware) with all that that implies . > Ect > > Is Billy T really concerned about/scared of > buyer-protection laws and regulations . > Surely not, alternatively why? > Caveat Vendito (Spelling?) Truly this is so, Consumer Guarantees act, Sale of goods act, Fair trading act, Minors goods act, and and and, Unscrupulous consumers regularly abuse these Acts', to obtain unfair advantage, Each new piece of regulation, bring a compliance cost and see more business persons say" this is too much wholesale only with my t/c from now on" . Increasing risk and cost to the street consumer . The mass of consumer protection law, regulations, and compliance costs are a major obstacle to the growth of small business . Some politicians (With stolen Brains) have argued without success for easement in this are to encourage small business growth . Remember small businesses are the MAINSTAY of our local economy . There is now that much protection that it encourages fly by night with the tax advantages and associated consumer costs . To many Retailers forget that they may legally refuse anyone’s business without reason . I was not going to get into this thread again but "Caveat Vendito" you not wrong .	drb1 (4492)
269009	2004-09-06 11:30:00	Hmm, I see the irony of using Keynes to dis philosophers, politicians and economists :^O The thing about well written standards (especially voluntary ones) is that they are more valuable to the trader as a best practice guide, they can be used to differentiate from traders who do not adhere to them and those that do . Most consumers only have a vague idea of there meaning at most . They can also be a good business tool to benchmark your organisation and compare it to others "how are we doing, are we doing it right, do we do enough, do too much, what does the market (niche) do" . Unfortunately it's a bit like RTFM, rarely done, or done to good effect, ie, lip service only . When mandatory standards are imposed without a robust enforcement regime (no such beast when the stakes are not high) then it is the shonky traders that can hide behind them, there is no differentiation except the result so back to buyer beware and reputation or lack of it which, as already stated is the final arbiter . Cheers Murray P	Murray P (44)
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