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Thread ID: 134779	2013-08-11 02:06:00	Abandon Ship?	fred_fish (15241)	PC World Chat

Post ID	Timestamp	Content	User
1351073	2013-08-15 10:52:00	Not good, not good at all.	NelsonB (17137)
1351074	2013-08-15 19:59:00	I can't get excited over the GCSB bills. In fact, it's 4 letters I'm totally sick of hearing / reading. Spying will happen. If the technology exists, then someone will investigate it and use it, whether that person be a telco employee, a hacker, a scammer, a researcher, a technophile, a hobbyist, or an employee of large corporates or governments. Better that we load the deck in the favour of those on the side of law and order, otherwise the advantage may slip to those on the opposite side of the law.	Paul.Cov (425)
1351075	2013-08-16 01:55:00	Much safer actually, since Norton doesn't detect anything.... Yes, but 'false positive' may lead you to lots unnecessary hassle although you may sue JK later and get millions of compensation. :D	bk T (215)
1351076	2013-08-19 12:25:00	Better that we load the deck in the favour of those on the side of law and order, otherwise the advantage may slip to those on the opposite side of the law. Yep, gotta keep them terrorists in check ... www.bbc.co.uk	fred_fish (15241)
1351077	2013-08-24 22:28:00	help.riseup.net Space for dissent It is a mistake to frame the recent US and European massive surveillance revelations in terms of the privacy of individuals. What is at stake is not privacy at all, but the power of the state over its citizenry. What surveillance really is, at its root, is a highly effective form of social control. The knowledge of always being watched changes our behavior and stifles dissent. The inability to associate secretly means there is no longer any possibility for free association. The inability to whisper means there is no longer any speech that is truly free of coercion, real or implied. Most profoundly, pervasive surveillance threatens to eliminate the most vital element of both democracy and social movements: the mental space for people to form dissenting and unpopular views. Many commentators, and Edward Snowden himself, have noted that these surveillance programs represent an existential threat to democracy. This understates the problem. The universal surveillance programs in place now are not simply a potential threat, they are certain to destroy democracy if left unchecked. Democracy, even the shadow of democracy we currently practice, rests on the bedrock foundation of free association, free speech, and dissent. The consequence of the coercive power of surveillance is to subvert this foundation and undermine everything democracy rests on. Within social movements, there is a temptation to say that nothing is really different. After all, governments have always targeted activist groups with surveillance and disruption, especially the successful ones. But this new surveillance is different. What the US government and European allies have built is an infrastructure for perfect social control. By automating the process of surveillance, they have created the ability to effortlessly peer into the lives of everyone, all the time, and thus create a system with unprecedented potential for controlling how we behave and think. True, this infrastructure is not currently used in this way, but it is a technical tool-kit that can easily be used for totalitarian ends. Those who imagine a government can be trusted to police itself when given the ominous power of precise insight into the inner workings of everyday life are betting the future on the ability of a secretive government to show proper self-restraint in the use of their ever-expanding power. If history has shown us anything, it is that the powerful will always use their full power unless they are forced to stop.	fred_fish (15241)
1351078	2013-08-24 22:53:00	... now they're watching :lol: Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? (en.wikipedia.org)	feersumendjinn (64)
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